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Region A & B

VHSL needs to realign Region B. It's 100% stupid the way the 1A teams are broken down into regions, 7 in one and 17 in the other. In playoffs, there are 2, 0-10 teams that got in. Heck, one of them has to travel to play a 2-8 team. The worse thing about this alignment in Region B is every team will make region playoffs, in every sport, and 2 teams get byes, where as in other regions, there are no byes. In football this gives Region B an advantage over Region A.
I wasn't good at math in school, but when you have 24 teams, there should be 12 in each region.
 
This problem was easily 100% predictable. And indeed it was easily predicted on this site over a year ago by several posters.

Region A and B are inherently and obviously unfair for every single sport.

Let's look at softball - Region A will have around 6 or 7 state worthy teams out of 17 teams.

Region B may have one or two good teams out of 7 teams.

Yet, Region B's one good team receives basically an automatic "pass" to states while Region A schools have to battle it out just to get to the final 4 in the Region.

Maybe combine Region A and B in Class 1A for the tournament is the only fair option.
 
If any of you were the AD of one of the Region A schools, who would you think should go to Region B? If you were coaching the school that you support, would you want to move to Region B? To me, Surry, Sussex and Franklin seem to be closer. That would make it 14 to 10 as far as football is concerned.
I agree with the original poster: I heard from an AD that some Region A schools were offered to come to Region B, but declined. I think when it comes down to it, we as fans want changes to balance things out, but if the AD's don't, then we just have to live with it. I imagine that if you ask a few coaches in Region A, they are happy with where they are now as far a playoffs are concerned.
I have a strong feeling that if Riverheads were to move up to 2A, or to Region C, then there would be a mass exodus from Region A to B!
At the end of the day, I imagine it will be Riverheads and either Sussex/Essex for the chance to get to the state final. They may have different paths to get there, but it won't matter when they face each other.
 
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Schools should not have a choice. VHSL should do the aligning . Now I know Principals and ADs make up VHSL, but all of them have college degrees, and studied math somewhere along the way. 24 divided by 2 = 12. Giving 6 school automatic berths in tournament screws majority of other schools in state. Heck, Region B can forget about regular season and just start preparing for playoffs on first day of practice in each sport. The have a "free-pass" to region tournament, and in some cases, free pass to state semi finals. So what if someone has to travel for a Region game. That's why we have school busses.
 
If any of you were the AD of one of the Region A schools, who would you think should go to Region B? If you were coaching the school that you support, would you want to move to Region B? To me, Surry, Sussex and Franklin seem to be closer. That would make it 14 to 10 as far as football is concerned.
I agree with the original poster: I heard from an AD that some Region A schools were offered to come to Region B, but declined. I think when it comes down to it, we as fans want changes to balance things out, but if the AD's don't, then we just have to live with it. I imagine that if you ask a few coaches in Region A, they are happy with where they are now as far a playoffs are concerned.
I have a strong feeling that if Riverheads were to move up to 2A, or to Region C, then there would be a mass exodus from Region A to B!
At the end of the day, I imagine it will be Riverheads and either Sussex/Essex for the chance to get to the state final. They may have different paths to get there, but it won't matter when they face each other.

I am a graduate of Sussex...please explain how 3hrs away is closer? I went to the Sussex and William Campbell game in 03..that was a 2 and half hr drive in the car...so on a bus may be close to 3 hrs. Really think another option should be looked at by the higher ups
 
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Schools should not have a choice. VHSL should do the aligning . Now I know Principals and ADs make up VHSL, but all of them have college degrees, and studied math somewhere along the way. 24 divided by 2 = 12. Giving 6 school automatic berths in tournament screws majority of other schools in state. Heck, Region B can forget about regular season and just start preparing for playoffs on first day of practice in each sport. The have a "free-pass" to region tournament, and in some cases, free pass to state semi finals. So what if someone has to travel for a Region game. That's why we have school busses.

Well HR6, there is NEVER going to be a system to please your many thoughts. No rematches??? I dont think these teams should be in, I certainly don't think it should be an uneven number in Region B playoffs (it should be 4), but then you still have BYES. And schools HAVE to care about money and travel expenses.

Now I certainly understand everyone's frustration. And the number disparaged in Region A and Region B looks bad, but everyone seems to be forgetting the fact that there ARE more teams in REGION B. 2 schools aren't eligible because of their schedule, and others just don't field football teams. But just to clarify, and I dont really care who wins 1a, this topic is about football, but the VHSL is about ALL COMPETITION, not just football and these schools that don't have football teams have other sports and competition and that HAVE to be placed somewhere.
 
Tidewater has at least one team in Region B already. Tri Rivers also has least one team in Region B already. Both of these Region B teams are really poor in almost all sports so this does not help at all in balancing the fairness of the regions.

I think a Middlesex poster said that they had heard that some other Tidewater team (or teams) was supposed to go to Region B but did not.

Also, the most western TRi Rivers teams were supposed to go to B.

Also, at least two Western teams like PM were supposed to realign but did not want to go to Region B - I assume because they do not want to play Riverheads in Football.

These issues may have made the VHSL look a tad moronic in their alignment/mathematical capabilities.
 
I am a graduate of Sussex...please explain how 3hrs away is closer? I went to the Sussex and William Campbell game in 03..that was a 2 and half hr drive in the car...so on a bus may be close to 3 hrs. Really think another option should be looked at by the higher ups

You are never going to get away from travel in 1A.
First round trips at or 2 hours:
Thomas Walker to PH-Glade Spring (2.5 hours)
Stonewall Jackson to Altavista
PM to GW
Auburn to Covington
Northampton to Essex (3 Hours)

Potential 2nd/3rd round travels:
Central L at Riverheads 2 hours
PM at Galax 2.5 hours.

Those are all google maps times, so you are right, on a bus it usually takes a little longer.
 
While many folks may disagree with HR6 and some of his opinions, he is right on in this case....

He is correct in this one instance with one region. But like I said above, and even though this is about football, everyone seems to be forgetting that it's not black and white 17/6. Those schools have to be aligned somewhere. I dont even know where they are, so maybe they should be in another region???

But in MY opinion, you could certainly have districts split, as some areas are larger than others. Without getting into the arguing about enrollment again, it's not Riverheads fault they are in Region B, or in a district with mostly 2a schools. I think PM and Covington make sense. But it wouldn't be smart to have an Essex, Sussex, etc in the same Region just to "even them out."

Again, I think the real number is 17/11 or 12. There are 49 teams in 1a according to maxpreps. That of course isn't including the schools without football program. That would be 12 per region. So anyone, let's hear how they should be split in your opinion?????
 
You are never going to get away from travel in 1A.
First round trips at or 2 hours:
Thomas Walker to PH-Glade Spring (2.5 hours)
Stonewall Jackson to Altavista
PM to GW
Auburn to Covington
Northampton to Essex (3 Hours)

Potential 2nd/3rd round travels:
Central L at Riverheads 2 hours
PM at Galax 2.5 hours.

Those are all google maps times, so you are right, on a bus it usually takes a little longer.
Best option may be to go back to the old regions. I actually like the 12 team format that 1A East had last year. Aside from the long travel you increase the chances of getting the best 2 teams playing for the state title. This year the top two teams come from Region A & B( Essex and Riverheads)
 
Get a state map, put the 12 western most schools in B and 12 most Eastern in A. Of the 24 schools in 1A, there are about 2 or 3 schools driving the train, if one knows what I mean.
 
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Get a state map, put the 12 western most schools in B and 12 most Eastern in A. Of the 24 schools in 1A, there are about 2 or 3 schools driving the train, if one knows what I mean.

I know what you mean, but you can't just take a map and do that the way the state is aligned and split. So I ask again, because I dont really care, but everyone wants to complain about it, so use the 49 teams... say your 12 team (13th in 1 region). You split them how you think. I wanna hear everyone's thoughts
 
The simple fact is that most schools in the 1A Region B section of Virginia have grown in student population. Let's look at 20-some years ago when the Group A threshold was 500 and below. These schools that are no longer 1A were classified as such then: Brentsville, Central-Woodstock, Clarke County, Manassas Park, George Mason, Page County, Strasburg, Amelia County, Fluvanna, Goochland, Powhatan, Prince Edward County, Randolph Henry, Buffalo Gap, Luray, Madison County, William Monroe, Stuarts Draft, Wilson Memorial.
Altavista and William Campbell, while having Group A size student enrollment, elected to play at the Group AA level back then.
 
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I know what you mean, but you can't just take a map and do that the way the state is aligned and split. So I ask again, because I dont really care, but everyone wants to complain about it, so use the 49 teams... say your 12 team (13th in 1 region). You split them how you think. I wanna hear everyone's thoughts

I enjoyed how it was last year and before for football in 1A East Region (which was regions A and B). March Madness style was fun and exciting! Not sure why it was changed.

No playoff format is perfect for everyone but that seemed to be the best and most exciting system. All good teams get in no problems.

12 teams from the Eastern Half of the State make it. 12 teams from the West make it.

You get rewarded for being in the top 4 elite teams for the regular season.

Do this playoff format for all sports - use the football power ratings system for all sports so that the ratings for Region seedings are as fair as possible.

I see many of the schools that complain about travel are schools with plenty of tax base (money) so that s--t complaining don't fly.

If districts still want to crown their own champions, they can during district tournament week.
 
So just out of curiosity is this going to be Region A playoff format for all sports? Because different sports have different number of schools participating just wondering
 
The simple fact is that most schools in the 1A Region B section of Virginia have grown in student population. Let's look at 20-some years ago when the Group A threshold was 500 and below. These schools that are no longer 1A were classified as such then: Brentsville, Central-Woodstock, Clarke County, Manassas Park, George Mason, Page County, Strasburg, Amelia County, Fluvanna, Goochland, Powhatan, Prince Edward County, Randolph Henry, Buffalo Gap, Luray, Madison County, William Monroe, Stuarts Draft, Wilson Memorial.
Altavista and William Campbell, while having Group A size student enrollment, elected to play at the Group AA level back then.

A little misleading with all those teams though. While they were all 1a, in last 20 years like you said, it was only 1a, 2a, 3a with 2 divisions
 
I enjoyed how it was last year and before for football in 1A East Region (which was regions A and B). March Madness style was fun and exciting! Not sure why it was changed.

No playoff format is perfect for everyone but that seemed to be the best and most exciting system. All good teams get in no problems.

12 teams from the Eastern Half of the State make it. 12 teams from the West make it.

You get rewarded for being in the top 4 elite teams for the regular season.

Do this playoff format for all sports - use the football power ratings system for all sports so that the ratings for Region seedings are as fair as possible.

I see many of the schools that complain about travel are schools with plenty of tax base (money) so that s--t complaining don't fly.

If districts still want to crown their own champions, they can during district tournament week.

I certainly liked the last format more, but I still would like to know how people would even it up. And again, the schools without football and ones not eligible still have to be included. So while it is 17/7 now, so you would think as HR6 was saying 24/2 is 12, then 5 teams should move. Then there is 12 in Region A, and 18/20 or so in Region B. But go with that to just even 12 for football, which 5 should move?

Seriously, I dislike them and especially SOME of their fans, but if Riverheads wasn't in this region I dont believe anybody, except HR6 as he has his views whether right or wrong (spread, rematch, etc), would be talking about it. The fact that the "red team" has been dominant and people already feel like they are cheating with numbers and now getting a pass is the reason this is an issue
 
Still the same..just different terminology. 6 state champs no matter how you label it

You missed the point I think. What he was saying (I believe) was the growth of schools and all of these teams used to be 1a. Some of them would have been considered what we now have as 2a was my point.

Just going off of my team, they have changed many times in past 20 years, including 3 different districts (Skyline, Valley, and Shenandoah). Went from really good teams back then from Fluvanna, Charlottesville, etc, to Harrisonburgs and Turner Ashby's (champs), to smaller schools like Stonewall and Riverheads
 
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I have heard of schools complaining if they had to travel 20 miles. The "Old Central Region" done this a lot, if my memory is correct.

Gretna has about a 2 hour trip to Floyd County Friday, I have heard no one complaining.
 
I have heard of schools complaining if they had to travel 20 miles. The "Old Central Region" done this a lot, if my memory is correct.

Gretna has about a 2 hour trip to Floyd County Friday, I have heard no one complaining.

Well that is a good little trip, but there would be double that and more if things changed a bit. I remember a couple years ago some team had like an 8 hr trip to go play a team around here. Good teams travel. I dont complain about a travel, we had like a 4+ hr trip a few years ago.

But a lot less fans will travel that far, which results in loss of money, not to mention the cost for schools.

Like I have said, doesn't matter how they are split to me, but the ones having an issue with it, what is your solution? It may fall on deaf ears for VHSL, BUT its possible
 
I get amused every time this subject comes up for discussion as it does quite often, and I am speaking of the regional discussion not the Riverheads 1 vs. 2 discussion. If you folks will just look at a map, as HR 6 is always encouraging us to do, then you will realize that this state of ours has one of the weirdest shapes of any of them. So there is not now, nor will there ever be, a way to make travel within Virginia a comfortable thing. I would be willing to bet that even in square states such as Colorado or Wyoming, they have more schools in one part than another and therefore they still cannot just divide the state into four equal-sized quarters and say "you belong here and you belong there."

I personally liked the 1-16 format better, because it gave the two best teams a chance to meet each other in the state championship game, no matter where they are located. Say for example, that next year Central and Clarke County are hands down the two absolute best teams in Division 2. Let's say that everybody knows it and there is not even any dispute about it.

Well under the regional system, the best they can do is meet in a regional final, which sends one of them home, whereas three other lesser teams still make the State Final Four. But under the 1-16 system, one of them would be number one in the east and the other would be number two. They would one by one knock out the rest of the competition until there was just the two of them and the two best teams in the west. Then, due to the cross-bracketing that was always used, they would STILL get the chance to knock out the two west teams and prove to the entire state that they were really the best two by being the ones to advance to the championship game, even if they were in the same district and had already played one another.

I always enjoy March Madness and I am sure that is the major reason why I liked that format. In either sport, it was always fun to see a 12 knock off a 5 or whatever, and if I am not mistaken, here in Virginia in football a few years ago, we did have a 16 knock off a 1.
 
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I get amused every time this subject comes up for discussion as it does quite often, and I am speaking of the regional discussion not the Riverheads 1 vs. 2 discussion. If you folks will just look at a map, as HR 6 is always encouraging us to do, then you will realize that this state of ours has one of the weirdest shapes of any of them. So there is not now, nor will there ever be, a way to make travel within Virginia a comfortable thing. I would be willing to bet that even in square states such as Colorado or Wyoming, they have more schools in one part than another and therefore they still cannot just divide the state into four equal-sized quarters and say "you belong here and you belong there."

I personally liked the 1-16 format better, because it gave the two best teams a chance to meet each other in the state championship game, no matter where they are located. Say for example, that next year Central and Clarke County are hands down the two absolute best teams in Division 2. Let's say that everybody knows it and there is not even any dispute about it.

Well under the regional system, the best they can do is meet in a regional final, which sends one of them home, whereas three other lesser teams still make the State Final Four. But under the 1-16 system, one of them would be number one in the east and the other would be number two. They would one by one knock out the rest of the competition until there was just the two of them and the two best teams in the west. Then, due to the cross-bracketing that was always used, they would STILL get the chance to knock out the two west teams and prove to the entire state that they were really the best two by being the ones to advance to the championship game, even if they were in the same district and had already played one another.

I always enjoy March Madness and I am sure that is the major reason why I liked that format. In either sport, it was always fun to see a 12 knock off a 5 or whatever, and if I am not mistaken, here in Virginia in football a few years ago, we did have a 16 knock off a 1.

We did, and it was from this area
 
Like Gunz I am curious as to how this vocal group thinks the split should be and who gets “made” to play where.
I will say again that I preferred the previous system and 12 is probably the right number not 16 on both sides. It just makes more sense than this mess. The travel argument needs to get dropped cause that is a crappy excuse for why we are in this condition. The whole argument about cost is ridiculous.
If you are the lower seed and you pull off that upset, isn’t it worth it? What is the likelihood of all these lower seeds playing round after round on the road? If you don’t want to travel to play then forfeit but for God’s sake quit complaining every year about something else.
Someone had to gripe about the last system or it would have stayed in place, which I think everyone has stated they liked better. Grass isn’t always greener on the other side guys.
 
I think we (WP) were gonna go Region B, but could not get anyone else to come with us. Personally I dont really care one way or the other. It didnt happen so it doesnt matter. I also liked the 12 team format with top 4 getting byes, but the west did not adopt that, because they felt it left to many teams out. The west complained that the top east teams had a bye, yet they didnt realize it was their AD's and principals whom agreed to the format. Someone posted a format a month or so ago that many other states use, anyone remember that? It seemed like a great idea. If we stay with the region format, I think it makes most sense for Tri River district, which at 1A level would be Sussex, Franklin, Windsor,Surry. But for football only. I think Sussex is probably only bout an hour to Lunenberg. If Windsor had made playoffs, they would have a 2-3 drive to the northern neck, so either way tri rivers teams gonna have to make so road trips
 
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When I get time I will take the 24 teams in A and B and divide them equally , to show how VHSL should have done it. I might grab a couple C schools and put them in B.
 
When I get time I will take the 24 teams in A and B and divide them equally , to show how VHSL should have done it. I might grab a couple C schools and put them in B.

That's all I have been saying. I dont agree with how it's Set up, but I certainly don't know what the answer is. Maybe it's something that football is different, if not then the other schools in Region B have to count
 
Like Gunz I am curious as to how this vocal group thinks the split should be and who gets “made” to play where.
I will say again that I preferred the previous system and 12 is probably the right number not 16 on both sides. It just makes more sense than this mess. The travel argument needs to get dropped cause that is a crappy excuse for why we are in this condition. The whole argument about cost is ridiculous.
If you are the lower seed and you pull off that upset, isn’t it worth it? What is the likelihood of all these lower seeds playing round after round on the road? If you don’t want to travel to play then forfeit but for God’s sake quit complaining every year about something else.
Someone had to gripe about the last system or it would have stayed in place, which I think everyone has stated they liked better. Grass isn’t always greener on the other side guys.

The 11 most Far Eastern teams are Chincoteague, Northampton, Northumberland, Rappahannock-Warsaw, Colonial Beach, Essex, Lancaster, W&L, King and Queen, Mathews, and Middlesex.

Windsor, Surry and West Point are on the Eastern border (for the 12th school).
 
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