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Back gets credit for 1 carry of zero yards. Offense gets credit for 1 penalty of 10 yards. In a situation like this the runner gets credit for yardage to the SPOT OF THE FOUL, not to where his forward progress was eventually stopped. The idea being any yards past the spot of the foul were obtained illegally, so the runner doesn't get credit for them. So all 10 yards between successive snaps of the football are accounted for. It is possible that the spot of the foul is actually ahead of where the ball carrier gets tackled. In that case, the basic spot is the end of the play, and the back would get credit for where he ended up. Think of it this way: the runner gets credit for the yardage (positive or negative) up to the spot where the refs are marking off the penalty.
You have to be careful though. The back only gets credit for a carry and yardage if it's a foul with a basic spot at the spot of the foul. Some penalties are always marked off from line of scrimmage (these don't count as carries), but almost of these are dead ball fouls, so it's easy to distinguish.
Runners also get credit for a carry and yardage on any defensive foul that is tacked on to the end of the run. Of the foul is marked off from the line of scrimmage there is no yardage or carry for the runner.
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The other time this gets nasty is if there is a half the distance to the goal penalty. Say, the ball is spotted on the 32. A play is run and a face mask penalty is called on the defense and the ball ends up on the 7 1/2 yard line. How does the statistician award yards? Answer: Since a face mask penalty is 15 yards and the ball ended up inside the 15, The penalty yards are double whatever the hardline is, so the penalty was 7 1/2 yards (we never award 1/2 yards). So really what we do in this situation is we count the penalty as 7 yards (the ball is not on the seven until it actually touches the 7). We give the back credit for the yards down to the 15 (where the penalty was marked off from). So he gets 17 yards on the carry. On the stat sheet we would say that the ball for the next play is spotted at the 8. All yards accounted for: the ball advanced 24 yards between snaps, 7 on penalty and 17 on run.
One even worse one to figure out. Ball on offenses' own 12 yard line. There is a live ball hold on the offense which is accepted. There is then a unsportsman like conduct penalty against the offense, and then there is another one on the defense (In that order). The ball ends up on the 16 hardline. How is this handled in the stats?
You have to work backwards. The ball ended up on the 16, so that means the penalty was marked of 15 yards against the defense from the 1. For the ball to have been on the 1, the offense's unsportsman like conduct foul must have been half the distance from the two, and the hold must have been half the distance from the 4. Meaning the hold happened 8 yards in the backfield. So how do we account for this 4 yard difference is spots in the book. Back is credited with an 8 yard loss. Offense is credited with 2 penalties for 3 yards. Defense is credited with one penalty for 15 yards. -8 + -2 + -1 +15 = 4. Since the ball is 4 yards further down field than on the previous snap, we've got every yard accounted for.
As long as you get the yard line written down, ball carrier, and penalties, you can always go back and figure out yardages later.
A few years ago some referees thought Darren was lying when he pointed out Bird's opponents only had two offensive holds against them in the entire regular season, but Darren writes down what every accepted penalty and what it is for; he's far too obsessive compulsive about the stats to lie.
I will say this, one bit of yardage many stat keepers do not put in the book (and I'm with them on this) is when a team takes a knee and runs out the clock at the end of a half or the game. The idea is not to punish a QB's rushing stats just because they're being good sports. Many don't include it as a carry, some do. I used to choose to ignore taking a knee as if a play hadn't even happened (unless there was a penalty).
Also, I've seen backs credited with three yards for running in an two point conversion on a try. I know that's not supposed to be done. Reason being is that it's an all or nothing proposition. Gaining 17 yards means nothing if you had to go 18 after a penalty for the conversion.
I've never known what to do with penalties on extra points, however. I always counted those in the stats.
Back gets credit for 1 carry of zero yards. Offense gets credit for 1 penalty of 10 yards. In a situation like this the runner gets credit for yardage to the SPOT OF THE FOUL, not to where his forward progress was eventually stopped. The idea being any yards past the spot of the foul were obtained illegally, so the runner doesn't get credit for them. So all 10 yards between successive snaps of the football are accounted for. It is possible that the spot of the foul is actually ahead of where the ball carrier gets tackled. In that case, the basic spot is the end of the play, and the back would get credit for where he ended up. Think of it this way: the runner gets credit for the yardage (positive or negative) up to the spot where the refs are marking off the penalty.
You have to be careful though. The back only gets credit for a carry and yardage if it's a foul with a basic spot at the spot of the foul. Some penalties are always marked off from line of scrimmage (these don't count as carries), but almost of these are dead ball fouls, so it's easy to distinguish.
Runners also get credit for a carry and yardage on any defensive foul that is tacked on to the end of the run. Of the foul is marked off from the line of scrimmage there is no yardage or carry for the runner.
Click to expand...
The other time this gets nasty is if there is a half the distance to the goal penalty. Say, the ball is spotted on the 32. A play is run and a face mask penalty is called on the defense and the ball ends up on the 7 1/2 yard line. How does the statistician award yards? Answer: Since a face mask penalty is 15 yards and the ball ended up inside the 15, The penalty yards are double whatever the hardline is, so the penalty was 7 1/2 yards (we never award 1/2 yards). So really what we do in this situation is we count the penalty as 7 yards (the ball is not on the seven until it actually touches the 7). We give the back credit for the yards down to the 15 (where the penalty was marked off from). So he gets 17 yards on the carry. On the stat sheet we would say that the ball for the next play is spotted at the 8. All yards accounted for: the ball advanced 24 yards between snaps, 7 on penalty and 17 on run.
One even worse one to figure out. Ball on offenses' own 12 yard line. There is a live ball hold on the offense which is accepted. There is then a unsportsman like conduct penalty against the offense, and then there is another one on the defense (In that order). The ball ends up on the 16 hardline. How is this handled in the stats?
You have to work backwards. The ball ended up on the 16, so that means the penalty was marked of 15 yards against the defense from the 1. For the ball to have been on the 1, the offense's unsportsman like conduct foul must have been half the distance from the two, and the hold must have been half the distance from the 4. Meaning the hold happened 8 yards in the backfield. So how do we account for this 4 yard difference is spots in the book. Back is credited with an 8 yard loss. Offense is credited with 2 penalties for 3 yards. Defense is credited with one penalty for 15 yards. -8 + -2 + -1 +15 = 4. Since the ball is 4 yards further down field than on the previous snap, we've got every yard accounted for.
As long as you get the yard line written down, ball carrier, and penalties, you can always go back and figure out yardages later.
A few years ago some referees thought Darren was lying when he pointed out Bird's opponents only had two offensive holds against them in the entire regular season, but Darren writes down what every accepted penalty and what it is for; he's far too obsessive compulsive about the stats to lie.
I will say this, one bit of yardage many stat keepers do not put in the book (and I'm with them on this) is when a team takes a knee and runs out the clock at the end of a half or the game. The idea is not to punish a QB's rushing stats just because they're being good sports. Many don't include it as a carry, some do. I used to choose to ignore taking a knee as if a play hadn't even happened (unless there was a penalty).
Also, I've seen backs credited with three yards for running in an two point conversion on a try. I know that's not supposed to be done. Reason being is that it's an all or nothing proposition. Gaining 17 yards means nothing if you had to go 18 after a penalty for the conversion.
I've never known what to do with penalties on extra points, however. I always counted those in the stats.
