Would Appo win the 4A west?
- Thread starter hamspear
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Yes, they are that good. Gotta throw the "2A" thing out the window with them. I hope they play Goochland this year just because of the contrast of styles. If you search Amherst The Cube on Google, you'll find the Appo game.
Yeh I know another team that you can throw the 2A thing out with. Well they are on a nice run, it is very impressive they can get so much out of so little.
Not so sure, Amherst beat Salem and Appomattox beat Amherst. Not a true analogy. They were just more prepared that night than Amherst and yes I said it. Amherst turned the ball over on the 3 yard line wthe that would have been 14-7 instead of 21-0. But I will give Appomattox credit as well, they are big and fast. Now would they beat Amherst again probably not. But I think they would win a game or two in 4A but they would not beat Woodgrove, Lake Taylor or Dinwiddie in my opinion
Not so sure, Amherst beat Salem and Appomattox beat Amherst. Not a true analogy per se. They were just more prepared that night than Amherst and yes I said it. Amherst turned the ball over on the 3 yard line wthe that would have been 14-7 instead of 21-0. But I will give Appomattox credit as well, they are big and fast. Now would they beat Amherst again probably not. But I think they would win a game or two in 4A but they would not beat Woodgrove, Lake Taylor or Dinwiddie in my opinion
The team that beat Salem had Turner, the team that lost to Appo and Brookville didn't. We'll never know though.
True also but the Appo game is harder to predict but Brookville game would definitely had been different no doubt
In answer to the original question, I would say "Insufficient data," as we don't yet know who will actually win 4A West, or how the games will go. And I would advise against using this year's Amherst - Salem game as some sort of guide for two reasons: the way Salem played defense in that game is very much not the way Salem has played defense the rest of the year; and, Beckley's quality of play in that game (particularly the second half) is very much not representative of his quality of play the rest of the year.
Appomattox is an excellent 2A team, in the midst of a two-year run that probably places the Raiders among the best ever in that classification (that being 2A and the old Division 2). They would probably at least be competitive with whichever two teams end up as this year's 4A finalists. I'd be content to leave it at that. The very top tier of 4A is very different from the top tier of 2A, just as there is a significant difference between the best 4A teams and the top 6A squads. Last year's Amherst team was nowhere near the top tier of 4A; we'll just have to wait to see if this year's Lancers reach those heights or not. I didn't include them in what I consider the top four favorites in the West because they would probably face back-to-back lengthy trips to Loudoun County to play two very good teams. Also, their qb's status appears to be uncertain. All that said, it wouldn't be the biggest surprise in the world if Amherst ends up playing in the 4A West final.
Appomattox is an excellent 2A team, in the midst of a two-year run that probably places the Raiders among the best ever in that classification (that being 2A and the old Division 2). They would probably at least be competitive with whichever two teams end up as this year's 4A finalists. I'd be content to leave it at that. The very top tier of 4A is very different from the top tier of 2A, just as there is a significant difference between the best 4A teams and the top 6A squads. Last year's Amherst team was nowhere near the top tier of 4A; we'll just have to wait to see if this year's Lancers reach those heights or not. I didn't include them in what I consider the top four favorites in the West because they would probably face back-to-back lengthy trips to Loudoun County to play two very good teams. Also, their qb's status appears to be uncertain. All that said, it wouldn't be the biggest surprise in the world if Amherst ends up playing in the 4A West final.
If Amherst wins the West then we probably know the answer to that question. If not then we are left with nothing but pure conjecture. Teams change during the year. Last year, at the beginning of the season, Salem and Jefferson Forest were about even, by the end of the year Salem was three touchdowns better on JF's home field.
Just used it as a way of stating my point. Amherst is also not the same they way they played against Salem and the way they are playing now, if they would have played like that night they would have not lost two games on my opinion. Derrick is a beast and it seemed like last Friday he didn't get the ball much that night. They have so many athletes so it doesn't make sense. They should do fine against Pulaski but I have no clue as to how good Dominion is
The VHSL classification system established originally as 3 classes and tweaked to 6 classes/divisions now recognizes the competitive advantage generally directly correlated with school enrollment size. Appomattox is a great 2A program and their wins over some 3's and 4's show they could compete in a higher classification, however, it is highly unlikely they would win the 4A West, in my opinion. Over the years, again in my opinion, there are an extremely small number of teams capable of jumping 2 or more classifications and being essentially top 2 in that class.
Appomattox would beat Amherst 9 out of 10 last year. And certainly 9 out of 10 times this year. Not even close.
I don't think they could win the 4a. But they sure have demolished the Seminole the last 2 yrs. Other than JF last yr.
I'll give ya 4 reasons Why it won' be close. #1 Amherst has not faced a offense like that . #2 They haven't faced a defense like that. #3 they haven't seen speed like that since their own teams of 06,07,08,09. And #4 and probably most important the coaching and preparation for Appo was off the charts. Amherst is very predictable on both sides of the ball. The D-coach for APPO is light years ahead of anyone in this area. I'm just saying the last 2 yrs. could have been worse than what the combined score of 73-19.
Amherst will have to play flawless ball and play like they did against Salem and Glass. Also need to make changes in game when something isn't working. Pass more if running isn't working, take chances. Keshon is that good of a player so who knows
Appo would definitely compete. I'd throw in this year's Dan River team also. I think they both could challenge the upper echelon of talent in 4a West.
The game simulator at VHSL reference would agree with you on Appomattox but, it is not quite as strong toward DR. Simulator had APPO favored to win in 50-60% range over 4(Salem, Byrd, Dominion and Amherst) of the 5 top seeded 4A teams. Woodgrove favored 54% of time. Appo and DR are good teams and the simulations for the current year are getting closer between a lot of the classifications. The point is not that the simulator is an absolute predictor, it is not(think of old saying about lies, damn lies and statistics), but, rather that there seems to be a narrowing/compression, statistically speaking, between classifications. Historically, both in computer simulation and, probably more importantly, the eye test there have been very few teams capable of jumping two or more levels of classification and competing, much less contending. Not exactly sure how to interpret this. Seems to raise two possible opinions, (1) that the overall quality of play continues to decline from historical levels and/or (2) the quality of play in lower classifications has improved relative to upper classifcations.
Always enjoys Gilliam's statistical analysis and not familiar with that ranking(not doubting your truth) but, I would be inclined to think there must have been some statistical oddity or flaw in the algorithm for that to occur. In my lifetime of watching HS football I do not ever recall a team from the smallest classification that I would consider to have been able to be competitive with the largest schools let alone be considered the top school in the state. Might happen in hoops with a smaller number of players but, I just do not see it in football.
I definitely believe Appo could compete in and possibly win the 4a West Region. If you have 20-25 guys who can play - you have a chance. Having a school population with 1400 or 1500 students would increase your chances of finding those 20-25 guys but a school with 700 students in a good cycle can get those guys. The demographics (I'm not just talking about race - I'm talking about the broad spectrum here) of a school district also plays a big factor in success - along with coaching, resources, support, etc.
I am originally from Eastern PA and a great example of a small school powerhouse is Imohtep Charter from Philadelphia. They have a total male enrollment of 262 - probably smaller than Appo - and they can compete with and probably beat any school in any classification in the state - they are just that good.
I am originally from Eastern PA and a great example of a small school powerhouse is Imohtep Charter from Philadelphia. They have a total male enrollment of 262 - probably smaller than Appo - and they can compete with and probably beat any school in any classification in the state - they are just that good.
Appomattox had as many players on the sidelines as Amherst, they are really good. People really like that Coach. I talked to a Heritage fan and he said even though they like Bradley they wish Smith never left
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I guess that is a good enough reason Rustburg and Amherst dropped Appo from the schedule next year.
What I have seen from appo that makes them so different from other teams is they have kids that want to play and when someone goes down there is no fall off to the next guy in line .most of the kids on the side line are ready to play at any time , credit to the coaching staff for preparing them to be ready !
Agreed. They lost a ton of talent last year. Most of those kids are playing in college now. Don't know the formula there ( I'm sure it starts with the coach) but it is fun to watch them play.
The formula is JIMMYS AND JOES, not taking away anything from Smith. They have bought in and perform for him, but having athletes matter. Think of Gretna during their run or William Campbell during their success, yes coaching matters but you got to have players.
Appomattox can line up and beat any 4A team in the state, no question. I'm not sure I would bet on them running the gauntlet, though. Sure, they have beaten Amherst . Could they turn around the next week and beat Salem and then Woodgrove? Not likely, but possible.
You either have team speed or you don't, coaching has nothing to do with that. And Appo has an abundance of team speed.
I agree with blackknight_pride. I believe Salem, Woodgrove and William Byrd would each have an ever so slight advantage. Had an opportunity to see Appo earlier in the season and came away extremely impressed. Obguthr brings up an excellent point. In a one game scenario, I believe they could contend and beat anyone in 4A West, but running the gauntlet would be extremely difficult.
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What makes you so sure? Because yall fumbled on the 3? Because you didnt have your QB? How do you give us credit and then follow it up with a statement like this.
I spoke with AD couple weeks ago and he said Rustburg is still on. We have renewed our old 80s 90s rivalry "Battle of the Lantern." I dont see that game going away anytime soon, both teams are right down street from each other and both bring big crowds (gate money is good). You are right about Amherst pulling out though. I know we are doing a LCA benefit game too before season. I know we are keeping Heritage on schedule too. I know about 2 new teams that are to replace Nelson, Amherst, but Im not going to list them because its not in stone yet. I LOVE THE MATCH UP of one team AD is going for. Team I dont ever remember us playing and yall gonna love this it as well.
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