As I sat in the stands tonight at the Moncan vs Bird game and watched the refs made it clear to Bird Coaches and players, that y'all not going to win this game tonight. In the first quarter Bird had 11 penalties to Moncan 1. Bird was up 14 to 10 all in the first quarter, Bird stop Moncan and they punted the ball and Bird now have the ball on their 24 yard line. CJ Donldson on a second and 7 to go break another 76 yard touch down, but as you know when he went into the end zone and 4 of his lineman running down the field with him, but wait there was I flag thrown and the refs couldn't give a correct number of the player that did the holding. CJ Donldson would have had 157 yards in just in 5 mins into the game, and they wasn't having it. Not on Senior night at Moncan. So with that being said, Bird punt to Moncan and this is when it get goooood. Bird defence Sack their quarterback and pushes them to there 15 yard line and on the next play Bird defence intercepted the ball on Moncan 12 yard remember Bird still up 14 to 10 already had a long run called back so the score should have been 21 to 10. Bird have the ball on the 12 yard line and guess what happen we had 3 hold an a unsportsmanlike penalty on 3 snaps of the ball, now Bird on Moncan 47 , while let's keep it close Mr. REF so Bird had to put and once again they would have been up 2 scores, and all this in the first quarter. But just to say this Bird not changing their offence to please other teams or refs. Tonight Bird had I think 28 penalties to Moncan 5. Give Moncan the state championship now they no how to play a perfect game. Dinnwidde you don't have a chance. And by the way this is a woman's point of view of a game that grown men took from kids and made it personal. I have been a Bird fan for over 17 years and tonight took the cake.
Bird foot WANT CHANGE so stop trying to CHANGE us
- Thread starter Dorsett033
- Start date
Not stunned that you would post this after Bird self destructs. You shouldn’t have had the TD’s you had. The first one shouldn’t have counted either. I have it on tape. Your offensive linemen are tackling our linebackers literally. And the one TD that was called back you tackled our defenders and your Qb went like 80 yards for a TD a few players later.
A Bird team that won this game for 18 yrs and who has gotten every bounce and every call and you are on the losing in one time and “there is a conspiracy”.
And as for the unsportsmanlikes your team hits after the whistle, tries to slam people down, late hits etc. it’s a regular day at the office for Bird. You do know Bird has a reputation of being a dirty team or is that oblivious to you as well!!
How many times did you jump offsides? 3x in a row on one drive? How many passes have you dropped in the last 2 games. I guess it is everyone else’s fault.
All the transfers to Bird and pulverizing losses Monacan has had... and we never once made statements like this. Never complained and even rooted for our fellow Domimion district foe come playoff time. So to see you post this now is disappointing.
The fact that you would actually say there is a conspiracy against LC Bird is flabbergasting after all of the success you have had.
The fact is, is LC Bird is a very good football team. But you are a 2 man show with Donaldson and your QB and they are one deminsional. You don’t have those 2 D-1 linebackers or a 240lb tailback this year.
Poor LC Bird... can we get out our tissues now.
I’ll still be rooting for Bird in the playoffs. If you want to bash us then so be it!
Bird holds more than almost any team I have seen, ever. It seems to be their style. They usually overcome that with their talent and athleticism, but not last night against a good team.
One thing I don't do is bash kids that play this game. It's y'all grown men on this website,wanna be coaches from the stands with all the answers. How do yall sound that Bird teach holding? I guess for the pass 8 years with a 2000 yard rushing back every year, they got all there yards holding. For the past 10 years we are the most penalized team in the state, and we still won 3 state championships. Y'all wanna be website coaches get out the stands. And if you think that was a good win then take it, go win a state championship and don't say anything on this website that may come back to haunt you, when you don't win a state title, because I will be watching website coaches.
Wether we win a state championship or not has nothing to do with it. What would come back haunt us? We are going to try to win a state championship as we have tried to do since every year we hit the field. And before you throw more arrows I am well aware that we have never succeeded. Sounds like that makes you happy.
The good news for you is there is a greater than 50% chance we will again come up trophy-less so you can bask in that glory after that fact and come back and say oh "I told you so". Then you can revel in satisfaction!
Even though I don't ever remember anyone on this board saying Monacan was even favored to win a state championship???
Sideline coaches on this site? You posted this... You are the only one who even posted about this game.
Mbonape, how did Fludd look last night? Comfortable? Do you have his stats?
I too have seen a lot of Bird games, but at 17 years you have me beat. My oldest son was a student at Bird and we were both present for the tough losses to Herm in the playoffs and the first two state title runs. Bird has long had a powerful running game with some very talented running backs. They have also long had a lot of holding penalties called on them nullifying many long runs. Yes, even during the championship runs. And as you have said; they will not change what they do or how they do it. If you are going to deny that they have been guilty of holding over the years, then that puts you in the category of Bird fanatic and not just Bird fan. I understand that some games it gets called more than others and that is frustrating. I know that sometimes it gets called and it looks like a phantom call and other times it doesn't get called when it is blatantly obvious and both are equally frustrating depending on which side of the call/no call you are on. My friends always complained that Bird held on every play and that the refs got tired of throwing the flag, but they never said Bird wasn't a good team.
I have always said the difference in those championship teams was the play of the QBs and there ability to throw and particularly throw on the run to the talented receivers that Bird had as well. That allowed Bird to dig out of the down and distance holes that the penalties got them into.
Thanks for sharing your opinion and backing your team. But please don't blame the other guys on here for supporting their teams and celebrating hard fought wins. And you can't blame us all for thinking that this Bird team is not at the same level as the past couple of years. It seems they have had as many if not more transfers out than in this season.
Good Luck to the Skyhawks the rest of the season!
Disclaimer: I’ve been a die-hard Bird fan for 20 years, so feel free to dismiss this as the delusional rantings of a Bird fanatic and go about your day.
I don’t see how anyone can watch Bird week after week and not think there’s a little something up between Bird and the refs. It has nothing to do with Monacan or any other team Bird is playing, it’s between Bird’s coaching staff and the refs. For example, Bird's opening game against Meadowbrook last year, a ref signals to Bedwell to come over between plays (presumably to tell him something), and as soon as Bedwell steps on the field the same ref flags him for a sideline warning. There's some kind of history there that started long before my time.
Bird has always been a run first offense, which generally leads to more holding penalties. I’m not trying to say that Bird doesn’t hold, because all high school teams do, but here are some of the issues I have with how those penalties get called:
· More than half the holding flags against Bird get thrown behind the line of scrimmage when the running back is 10+ yards past the line of scrimmage. If you’re going to throw a flag, throw it when the hold happens, not when you see that it’s going to be a big play.
· You’ve got refs 20 yards away from the play and out of position throwing holding flags against Bird, yet they don’t call blatant holds by Bird opponents when they’re positioned 5 yards away from the play.
· Penalties against Bird (especially holding calls) tend to drop off significantly later in the playoffs when it’s not a local officiating crew.
· In games where Bird’s opponent is significantly overmatched, there are multiple holding calls every series at the beginning of the game when it’s still close. Those penalties tend to drop off after Bird is up 3-4 scores and the second and third string is in.
Not saying this is any condemning evidence of collusion, but when you watch it week after week for 20+ years, it does tend to get old and lead you to think that something isn’t right.
Then there’s the disparity in penalties called against each team, which almost always goes against Bird. This isn’t specific to last week’s game against Monacan, but there were a couple pretty blatant holds that Monacan didn’t get called for, which happens every game when you play Bird. On one punt return, Bird signaled for a fair catch well in advance and a Monacan kid ran into the punt returner – not a ton of contact and not malicious, but still clear kick catch interference and no flag. Later, when Monacan attempted an onside kick that didn’t go 10 yards and one of their players touched the ball while it was still live, there was no flag for illegal touching. There’s always going to be some margin of error, especially in high school officiating, but those were two pretty obvious ones that got ignored.
Over the years, I’ve seen that in Bird games, flags usually cost Bird two touchdowns a game – whether it’s offensive touchdowns getting called back or drives getting killed with penalties, or defensive flags against Bird keeping the opponent’s drive alive and leading to scores. How much of that is Bird doing it to themselves and how much is ref bias depends on what side of the fence you’re on.
In the past, Bird has been good enough to cover that spread. However, with Bird’s (not altogether unexpected) nosedive this year coupled with Manchester and Monacan’s rise, Bird can’t cover it this year. Funny thing is, with the way the playoffs are set up now, it doesn’t really matter if Bird went 10-0 or 7-3 in the regular season – the best they could get is a 3-seed and one home game. Now they’re looking at a 4-seed still with the home game, then either way have to travel to Herm or HSHS in the second round and most likely get blown out.
Clearly it’s been a down year for Bird with Bedwell stepping down, but even with him at the helm I don’t think this year’s team would get past Herm or HSHS anyway.
Good news for Skyhawk fans is that we should have our pick of coaches for next year and can start to rebuild.
I don’t see how anyone can watch Bird week after week and not think there’s a little something up between Bird and the refs. It has nothing to do with Monacan or any other team Bird is playing, it’s between Bird’s coaching staff and the refs. For example, Bird's opening game against Meadowbrook last year, a ref signals to Bedwell to come over between plays (presumably to tell him something), and as soon as Bedwell steps on the field the same ref flags him for a sideline warning. There's some kind of history there that started long before my time.
Bird has always been a run first offense, which generally leads to more holding penalties. I’m not trying to say that Bird doesn’t hold, because all high school teams do, but here are some of the issues I have with how those penalties get called:
· More than half the holding flags against Bird get thrown behind the line of scrimmage when the running back is 10+ yards past the line of scrimmage. If you’re going to throw a flag, throw it when the hold happens, not when you see that it’s going to be a big play.
· You’ve got refs 20 yards away from the play and out of position throwing holding flags against Bird, yet they don’t call blatant holds by Bird opponents when they’re positioned 5 yards away from the play.
· Penalties against Bird (especially holding calls) tend to drop off significantly later in the playoffs when it’s not a local officiating crew.
· In games where Bird’s opponent is significantly overmatched, there are multiple holding calls every series at the beginning of the game when it’s still close. Those penalties tend to drop off after Bird is up 3-4 scores and the second and third string is in.
Not saying this is any condemning evidence of collusion, but when you watch it week after week for 20+ years, it does tend to get old and lead you to think that something isn’t right.
Then there’s the disparity in penalties called against each team, which almost always goes against Bird. This isn’t specific to last week’s game against Monacan, but there were a couple pretty blatant holds that Monacan didn’t get called for, which happens every game when you play Bird. On one punt return, Bird signaled for a fair catch well in advance and a Monacan kid ran into the punt returner – not a ton of contact and not malicious, but still clear kick catch interference and no flag. Later, when Monacan attempted an onside kick that didn’t go 10 yards and one of their players touched the ball while it was still live, there was no flag for illegal touching. There’s always going to be some margin of error, especially in high school officiating, but those were two pretty obvious ones that got ignored.
Over the years, I’ve seen that in Bird games, flags usually cost Bird two touchdowns a game – whether it’s offensive touchdowns getting called back or drives getting killed with penalties, or defensive flags against Bird keeping the opponent’s drive alive and leading to scores. How much of that is Bird doing it to themselves and how much is ref bias depends on what side of the fence you’re on.
In the past, Bird has been good enough to cover that spread. However, with Bird’s (not altogether unexpected) nosedive this year coupled with Manchester and Monacan’s rise, Bird can’t cover it this year. Funny thing is, with the way the playoffs are set up now, it doesn’t really matter if Bird went 10-0 or 7-3 in the regular season – the best they could get is a 3-seed and one home game. Now they’re looking at a 4-seed still with the home game, then either way have to travel to Herm or HSHS in the second round and most likely get blown out.
Clearly it’s been a down year for Bird with Bedwell stepping down, but even with him at the helm I don’t think this year’s team would get past Herm or HSHS anyway.
Good news for Skyhawk fans is that we should have our pick of coaches for next year and can start to rebuild.
On a clearly different note and tone, I would like to take a quick moment to give an enormous, hearty THANK YOU to all of my English and Grammar teachers from the early 80's at King William High School....PRE-SOL era, might I add.
That is all....please carry-on.
That is all....please carry-on.
@lcbskyhawks thank you for your reasonable and articulate post. Agree that the interference on the punt returner could have been called. Was a 50-50 call and as you said nominal contact. I don't think it had any outcome on the game. The second piece is LCB did have a TD called back but LCB scored 3 plays later anyways so that had no effect on the game.
As for the history of penalties... I have no problem with you questioning it... It can be frustrating to say the least.
I can tell you that Monacan has at least 2-3 scoring drives PENALTIED away every week. Some of it is phantom some of it is legit. The reason we have been in some close games this year was Self Destruction. Even against Manchester we had a punt blocked and an interception inside our own 20 yrd line. SMH! In several other games this year within 3 plays we are in the other teams redzone and 3 penalties later it is 4th and 30. That sequence happens numerous times in the game. It is just the trials and tribulations of high school football.
As I said before, Bird is not that down. Are you down from last year? Yes, but LCB still had every opportunity to win the Manchester game. I can go almost as far to say you SHOULD HAVE won that one. Against Monacan LCB dropped passes, fumbled, jumped offsides and had a rack of personal fouls. I think if you played that Dale game again it would look a lot different the second time around. My point is that LCB has played sloppy and self destructed this year at times. The good news is that this is all correctable.
I agree that ultimately HSHS and Hermitage are a cut above this year. I think you may have a first round game with Varina and that could be very interesting and a whale of a game.
Do you think there is going to be a coaching change like you eluded to in your above post? Are we jumping the gun on that? Nicely only gets one year? What is left after Donaldson and your QB graduate?
I have to tell you that I think Donaldson is a tremendous back and if he was 25lbs heavier he would be a MAJOR D1 recruit. Happy to see him shine this year.
I think you have a 50-50 shot at a first round win. You know as well as I do even with a stacked team it is HARD to get out of the Richmond region in 5A. Those 3 state titles that Bird won... how many of those would HSHS or Hermitage have won if they would have beaten Bird? You can say the same thing every year with those 3 teams. The only year I think ONLY Bird would have won was against Ocean Lakes.
Bird, Hermitage, and HSHS are trapped in a never ending arms race. The margin of separation is sooo small on any given year or Friday night.
The Monacan community will be rooting for you as long as you are not playing us.
Good luck in the playoffs!
As for the history of penalties... I have no problem with you questioning it... It can be frustrating to say the least.
I can tell you that Monacan has at least 2-3 scoring drives PENALTIED away every week. Some of it is phantom some of it is legit. The reason we have been in some close games this year was Self Destruction. Even against Manchester we had a punt blocked and an interception inside our own 20 yrd line. SMH! In several other games this year within 3 plays we are in the other teams redzone and 3 penalties later it is 4th and 30. That sequence happens numerous times in the game. It is just the trials and tribulations of high school football.
As I said before, Bird is not that down. Are you down from last year? Yes, but LCB still had every opportunity to win the Manchester game. I can go almost as far to say you SHOULD HAVE won that one. Against Monacan LCB dropped passes, fumbled, jumped offsides and had a rack of personal fouls. I think if you played that Dale game again it would look a lot different the second time around. My point is that LCB has played sloppy and self destructed this year at times. The good news is that this is all correctable.
I agree that ultimately HSHS and Hermitage are a cut above this year. I think you may have a first round game with Varina and that could be very interesting and a whale of a game.
Do you think there is going to be a coaching change like you eluded to in your above post? Are we jumping the gun on that? Nicely only gets one year? What is left after Donaldson and your QB graduate?
I have to tell you that I think Donaldson is a tremendous back and if he was 25lbs heavier he would be a MAJOR D1 recruit. Happy to see him shine this year.
I think you have a 50-50 shot at a first round win. You know as well as I do even with a stacked team it is HARD to get out of the Richmond region in 5A. Those 3 state titles that Bird won... how many of those would HSHS or Hermitage have won if they would have beaten Bird? You can say the same thing every year with those 3 teams. The only year I think ONLY Bird would have won was against Ocean Lakes.
Bird, Hermitage, and HSHS are trapped in a never ending arms race. The margin of separation is sooo small on any given year or Friday night.
The Monacan community will be rooting for you as long as you are not playing us.
Good luck in the playoffs!
@lcbskyhawks thank you for your reasonable and articulate post. Agree that the interference on the punt returner could have been called. Was a 50-50 call and as you said nominal contact. I don't think it had any outcome on the game. The second piece is LCB did have a TD called back but LCB scored 3 plays later anyways so that had no effect on the game.
As for the history of penalties... I have no problem with you questioning it... It can be frustrating to say the least.
I can tell you that Monacan has at least 2-3 scoring drives PENALTIED away every week. Some of it is phantom some of it is legit. The reason we have been in some close games this year was Self Destruction. Even against Manchester we had a punt blocked and an interception inside our own 20 yrd line. SMH! In several other games this year within 3 plays we are in the other teams redzone and 3 penalties later it is 4th and 30. That sequence happens numerous times in the game. It is just the trials and tribulations of high school football.
As I said before, Bird is not that down. Are you down from last year? Yes, but LCB still had every opportunity to win the Manchester game. I can go almost as far to say you SHOULD HAVE won that one. Against Monacan LCB dropped passes, fumbled, jumped offsides and had a rack of personal fouls. I think if you played that Dale game again it would look a lot different the second time around. My point is that LCB has played sloppy and self destructed this year at times. The good news is that this is all correctable.
I agree that ultimately HSHS and Hermitage are a cut above this year. I think you may have a first round game with Varina and that could be very interesting and a whale of a game.
Do you think there is going to be a coaching change like you eluded to in your above post? Are we jumping the gun on that? Nicely only gets one year? What is left after Donaldson and your QB graduate?
I have to tell you that I think Donaldson is a tremendous back and if he was 25lbs heavier he would be a MAJOR D1 recruit. Happy to see him shine this year.
I think you have a 50-50 shot at a first round win. You know as well as I do even with a stacked team it is HARD to get out of the Richmond region in 5A. Those 3 state titles that Bird won... how many of those would HSHS or Hermitage have won if they would have beaten Bird? You can say the same thing every year with those 3 teams. The only year I think ONLY Bird would have won was against Ocean Lakes.
Bird, Hermitage, and HSHS are trapped in a never ending arms race. The margin of separation is sooo small on any given year or Friday night.
The Monacan community will be rooting for you as long as you are not playing us.
I believe it was stated when Nicely took the job that it was not permanent, he was just a temp more less because of the timing of Bedwell stepping down. No one knew the program better than him and would provide continuity.
Yep, that's what I've heard as well. Because Bird's AD left so late in the year and then Bedwell got the job, it was a choice between doing a quick search with limited candidates or getting Nicely to agree to be interim HC for this year. I don't think he has any interest in the position long-term.
The poster alleging collusion by officials is ridiculous. They're out here for the love of the game and for the kids. They see a foul and they call it. Do they miss some? Obviously, it's a part of the game. But to allege intentional conspiracy against one team? Ridiculous. That's the only response necessary to a post like that.
I appreciate this very well articulated post and I can see every point that you've made. Allow me to counter from the other side of the line with a sport's official's perspective.
Bird historically has been one of the most penalized teams in the state, but a neutral observer will also tell you that they do foul more than most teams in the state as well. Not to say you can't be a neutral observer as a fan, because you can. It's just extremely difficult and there is always a faint tinge of bias even if you don't mean for there to be.
The way you painted the picture with the official and Bedwell sounds like you didn't hear the conversation that occurred between them. The sideline warning could very well have been via the conversation rather than the official calling the coach on the field and flagging him. That, I will guarantee you, is not how it happened. I know that because a sideline warning is only given for being in the restricted area while the ball is live (not while it's dead as you said). The official could have given a verbal warning to stay out of the restricted area while the ball was live, and the coach may have said some words which took the verbal warning to an actual one.
For your first point about holding fouls thrown behind the runner, there's something many fans need to know about flags. One officiating principle that encompasses all sports is "advantage / disadvantage." In relation to football, before you throw the flag, you need to ask yourself, "did this affect the play?" If the defender is held, but he still makes the tackle, did it affect the play? No. If there is a hold at the point of attack and another defender tackles the runner behind where the hold took place, was there an advantage? No. Operating on this principle, officials hold their flags until they know that an actual advantage was gained. This is a very good officiating practice that removes unnecessary penalties from being thrown. While that flag may have been thrown 10 yards behind the runner, the holding foul undoubtedly took place a few seconds prior to when it was thrown while the runner was still in that area. The official was just patient to make sure that the foul actually affected the play and an advantage was gained. Seeing as the runner gained at least 10 more yards after the foul, a flag was warranted.
You mentioned a referee throwing a flag while they are out of position, but do you know the mechanics yourself? Do you know what that officials keys and responsibilities are during that play? What specific player is he responsible for? If you aren't an official yourself, I would have to guess no. Many times, a deep official that is far away from the play has the best look on certain fouls and they are within his coverage area. Just because the flag is thrown from a great distance doesn't mean the foul didn't occur or that the official wasn't observing his primary responsibility.
To your 3rd point about local crews, the Richmond area, in my opinion, has some of the best officials in the state top to bottom. Have you ever thought that maybe when LCB travels out of the area, the "non-local" crews may not be as well trained or experienced, and therefore let things go (like holds) that good officials do not?
To your point about not throwing flags when the game is well out of hand, when the game is tight it has to be called by the book. But, the best thing a crew can do when the game is extremely lopsided and there is no hope for a comeback is to get the game over with as quickly as possible. The only thing that can come of the game at that point is potential fights or unsportsmanlike acts. Throwing minor penalties only stop the clock and make the game last way longer than it needs to, which is a recipe for disaster with one team extremely happy and one team extremely down or frustrated. Also, as a general note, I've heard many officials tell me that the 2nd and 3rd teams play much cleaner than the starters. I don't know why, but it's something they've noticed overall. They'll make simple mistakes like encroachments and false starts, but they don't commit fouls like holding as much.
To your point about the onside kick, there was no flag on that play because there's not supposed to be a flag on that play. The kicking team touching the ball in the neutral zone on a free kick (i.e., the 10 yards between the K and R restraining lines) is referred to as FIRST touching (in HS), not illegal touching. First touching is not a foul. It's treated the same as if the kicking team touched the ball on a punt beyond the neutral zone. The receiving team has the option of taking the ball at that spot, so a bean bag is thrown there, not a flag.
I have a lot of fans ask me if I could give them one piece of advice about watching games, what would it be? My answer: if you don't know for 100% certainty what is written in the rules book or general officiating mechanics, do not assume. Assuming without due diligence leads to things like believing the officials got it wrong or that the officials are conspiring against your team. 100% certainty does not mean "I've seen this enforced 1000 times, I know it" or "I saw this in a high school / college game last week." 100% certainty means you have placed your own eyes on the exact rule in question in the NFHS Football Rules Book. If every fan would take a few minutes to do the research and open the book, it would open their eyes that much wider to the game that they love, and maybe they wouldn't yell at those zebras as much. (Yeah right!)
Just an inside look on the other side of the fence.
Side note / plug: the number of officials across the country are down dramatically. Most officials' reasons for not continuing are the treatment they receive by fans and coaches, which has gotten exponentially worse in the last 10-15 years. These shortages are going to be felt widespread, so I ask fans to do one of two things: stop berating officials if you want to see your sport exist (without officials, it won't), OR, keep yelling but become an official yourself! God knows we need the numbers.
I appreciate this very well articulated post and I can see every point that you've made. Allow me to counter from the other side of the line with a sport's official's perspective.
Bird historically has been one of the most penalized teams in the state, but a neutral observer will also tell you that they do foul more than most teams in the state as well. Not to say you can't be a neutral observer as a fan, because you can. It's just extremely difficult and there is always a faint tinge of bias even if you don't mean for there to be.
The way you painted the picture with the official and Bedwell sounds like you didn't hear the conversation that occurred between them. The sideline warning could very well have been via the conversation rather than the official calling the coach on the field and flagging him. That, I will guarantee you, is not how it happened. I know that because a sideline warning is only given for being in the restricted area while the ball is live (not while it's dead as you said). The official could have given a verbal warning to stay out of the restricted area while the ball was live, and the coach may have said some words which took the verbal warning to an actual one.
For your first point about holding fouls thrown behind the runner, there's something many fans need to know about flags. One officiating principle that encompasses all sports is "advantage / disadvantage." In relation to football, before you throw the flag, you need to ask yourself, "did this affect the play?" If the defender is held, but he still makes the tackle, did it affect the play? No. If there is a hold at the point of attack and another defender tackles the runner behind where the hold took place, was there an advantage? No. Operating on this principle, officials hold their flags until they know that an actual advantage was gained. This is a very good officiating practice that removes unnecessary penalties from being thrown. While that flag may have been thrown 10 yards behind the runner, the holding foul undoubtedly took place a few seconds prior to when it was thrown while the runner was still in that area. The official was just patient to make sure that the foul actually affected the play and an advantage was gained. Seeing as the runner gained at least 10 more yards after the foul, a flag was warranted.
You mentioned a referee throwing a flag while they are out of position, but do you know the mechanics yourself? Do you know what that officials keys and responsibilities are during that play? What specific player is he responsible for? If you aren't an official yourself, I would have to guess no. Many times, a deep official that is far away from the play has the best look on certain fouls and they are within his coverage area. Just because the flag is thrown from a great distance doesn't mean the foul didn't occur or that the official wasn't observing his primary responsibility.
To your 3rd point about local crews, the Richmond area, in my opinion, has some of the best officials in the state top to bottom. Have you ever thought that maybe when LCB travels out of the area, the "non-local" crews may not be as well trained or experienced, and therefore let things go (like holds) that good officials do not?
To your point about not throwing flags when the game is well out of hand, when the game is tight it has to be called by the book. But, the best thing a crew can do when the game is extremely lopsided and there is no hope for a comeback is to get the game over with as quickly as possible. The only thing that can come of the game at that point is potential fights or unsportsmanlike acts. Throwing minor penalties only stop the clock and make the game last way longer than it needs to, which is a recipe for disaster with one team extremely happy and one team extremely down or frustrated. Also, as a general note, I've heard many officials tell me that the 2nd and 3rd teams play much cleaner than the starters. I don't know why, but it's something they've noticed overall. They'll make simple mistakes like encroachments and false starts, but they don't commit fouls like holding as much.
To your point about the onside kick, there was no flag on that play because there's not supposed to be a flag on that play. The kicking team touching the ball in the neutral zone on a free kick (i.e., the 10 yards between the K and R restraining lines) is referred to as FIRST touching (in HS), not illegal touching. First touching is not a foul. It's treated the same as if the kicking team touched the ball on a punt beyond the neutral zone. The receiving team has the option of taking the ball at that spot, so a bean bag is thrown there, not a flag.
I have a lot of fans ask me if I could give them one piece of advice about watching games, what would it be? My answer: if you don't know for 100% certainty what is written in the rules book or general officiating mechanics, do not assume. Assuming without due diligence leads to things like believing the officials got it wrong or that the officials are conspiring against your team. 100% certainty does not mean "I've seen this enforced 1000 times, I know it" or "I saw this in a high school / college game last week." 100% certainty means you have placed your own eyes on the exact rule in question in the NFHS Football Rules Book. If every fan would take a few minutes to do the research and open the book, it would open their eyes that much wider to the game that they love, and maybe they wouldn't yell at those zebras as much. (Yeah right!)
Just an inside look on the other side of the fence.
Side note / plug: the number of officials across the country are down dramatically. Most officials' reasons for not continuing are the treatment they receive by fans and coaches, which has gotten exponentially worse in the last 10-15 years. These shortages are going to be felt widespread, so I ask fans to do one of two things: stop berating officials if you want to see your sport exist (without officials, it won't), OR, keep yelling but become an official yourself! God knows we need the numbers.
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Funny thing about 2012 when Bird beat Ocean Lakes, we should have lost in the first round to Herm. They were up a couple scores with not much time left and kept passing the ball (I guess trying to get another score and put the game completely out of reach) instead of running the ball and eating up clock. Bird scored shortly after an interception and then got the ball back again after a 3 and out that ran less than a minute off the clock and scored again to win. Better clock management and a that season could have ended very differently.
Since the playoffs expanded to 8 teams, you're right, whoever wins that third game among Bird/HSHS/Herm goes on to win states. The strength of 5A is definitely concentrated in Richmond.
Yeah Hermitage has been on the bad end of a few blunders. Keep in mind as good as Hermitage has been for years they still don't have a state title. That is crazy! What season was it that LCB caught the Hail Mary at the end of the game vs Dale? Was that a State championship season or did HSHS win it that year?
That was 2014, the last of Bird's 3 in a row before HSHS started their streak.
Here's a video of the Hail Mary:
I agree that 5A is very strong in Richmond, and that a team from RVA has won it the past four years, but don't sleep on Stone Bridge. Not only are they better than last year, but the football gods have to smile on them sooner or later-perhaps this year?
