Was at a game Friday where a kid scored a touchdown and as he turned back to head to the sidelines he crossed his chest as a teammate came up to him they hit forearms together and pointed to the heavens and he was flagged for excessive celebration. I know the kid and he is reliegous, not like it was a gang sign or anything. Not trying to get the ACLU involved or anything but I have read the EC rule and was just wondering your thoughts or comments
Excessive Celebration / Whitehat
- Thread starter Mr. Mez
- Start date
Not to defend the call because I didn't read about anything I personally would have flagged, but I didn't see it. You say you know the kid and know he's religious and not in a gang. Does the official know that?
Here's the thing... this is all opinion. This call is 100 percent judgment and I can describe in great detail what I would flag and what I wouldn't and it doesn't make a bit of difference because there are about 700 people officiating football in Virginia and there are 700 different opinions on what should or shouldn't be flagged.
A friend of mine who coaches a very successful team has a handout he gives to players and their parents when it comes to that. He expects it to be taped into their playbooks.
"We, as coaches, want you to enjoy playing football and we know it is a game of emotions and celebration. Just understand that what you don't know about the refs, they don't know about you. Are the refs religious and will flag you for swearing? Assume they are and don't swear. Are you religious and want to point to the sky or someone special in heaven? The refs don't know if you're religious or not and pointing to heaven looks just like telling everyone you are #1. Point to heaven when you get back to the sideline and not a second before. Heaven will still be there. When you score, act like you've been there before. Celebrate and accept congratulations from teammates, but after a few seconds it's enough. You don't need to chest bump everyone on the field. Some refs will let you, some won't. Do you know which is reffing our game? I doubt it. Do not ever look at the other team when celebrating. If you do, you will answer to us, the coaches, about that because we teach you better than that. If you act the way we teach you, you will never be flagged because the refs will not have to make a decision whether or not to flag you. Don't do anything that makes them make a decision. You might not like what they decide."
Here's the thing... this is all opinion. This call is 100 percent judgment and I can describe in great detail what I would flag and what I wouldn't and it doesn't make a bit of difference because there are about 700 people officiating football in Virginia and there are 700 different opinions on what should or shouldn't be flagged.
A friend of mine who coaches a very successful team has a handout he gives to players and their parents when it comes to that. He expects it to be taped into their playbooks.
"We, as coaches, want you to enjoy playing football and we know it is a game of emotions and celebration. Just understand that what you don't know about the refs, they don't know about you. Are the refs religious and will flag you for swearing? Assume they are and don't swear. Are you religious and want to point to the sky or someone special in heaven? The refs don't know if you're religious or not and pointing to heaven looks just like telling everyone you are #1. Point to heaven when you get back to the sideline and not a second before. Heaven will still be there. When you score, act like you've been there before. Celebrate and accept congratulations from teammates, but after a few seconds it's enough. You don't need to chest bump everyone on the field. Some refs will let you, some won't. Do you know which is reffing our game? I doubt it. Do not ever look at the other team when celebrating. If you do, you will answer to us, the coaches, about that because we teach you better than that. If you act the way we teach you, you will never be flagged because the refs will not have to make a decision whether or not to flag you. Don't do anything that makes them make a decision. You might not like what they decide."
Would you flag this?
This was flagged for excessive celebration. Do you agree?
Please comment here and not on the youtube page.
This post was edited on 10/17 6:23 AM by White hat
Would you flag this?
This was flagged for excessive celebration. Do you agree?
Please comment here and not on the youtube page.
This post was edited on 10/17 6:23 AM by White hat
Would you flag this?
This is a rule that needs tweaking. there are too many gray areas. I have seen players make a complete _______ of themselves after a TD or a defensive play and not get flagged. then I have seen players do very little and get flagged. It's all in judgement of the officials. This is one time I wish we had instant replay in high school, where it could be reviewed.
Re: Would you flag this?
I have seen less than that flagged for EC. I am not a football ref, but from what I've seen called in games I have watched, and from conversations with friends that are officials, I would have to say I would flag that.
I have seen less than that flagged for EC. I am not a football ref, but from what I've seen called in games I have watched, and from conversations with friends that are officials, I would have to say I would flag that.
Thanks for your response. I wasn't really looking for affirmation on condemnation just wanted your thoughts . I personally didn't think it deserved a flag as it wasn't really an attempt to bring attention to himself , just two kids giving thanks for natural abilities and a lot less " excessive" than the chest bumping that seems to be allowed now. One point of contention , you say there are 700 officials , maybe on the field, but I say there are tens of thousands more in the stands who are always right.Thanks again...
A rule in basketball is if you pull your jersey up and pound your chest to celebrate,it is supposed to be a T. I saw it called in a game a couple of years ago when Logan Thomas and Brookville were getting beat by a lesser team and the fans really got all over the refs. A few sitting around me said it a ticky tacky foul. I will ignore a little bit of it, but not a really bad situation.
Re: Would you flag this?
I would say the question to ask in every case is: is the player celebrating or is he bringing attention to himself ?
I would say the question to ask in every case is: is the player celebrating or is he bringing attention to himself ?
Re: Would you flag this?
Celebrating or bringing attention to himself, what's the difference? If a college punter can have a td taken away for raising his arms with the ball on the 5 yd line on a crazy fake punt run, then this hs player will get flagged for his dance, celebration, air boxing, whatever that was in the video White Hat is asking us to comment on.
Celebrating or bringing attention to himself, what's the difference? If a college punter can have a td taken away for raising his arms with the ball on the 5 yd line on a crazy fake punt run, then this hs player will get flagged for his dance, celebration, air boxing, whatever that was in the video White Hat is asking us to comment on.
Re: Would you flag this?
I think celebrating is worse in baseball and basketball than in football. that's what needs cracking down on
I think celebrating is worse in baseball and basketball than in football. that's what needs cracking down on
Re: Would you flag this?
The rule bok does not use the term "excessive celebration." I'm pretty sure that's from college ball and seen on TV. That's OK, it works, but the rule book just says "any delayed, excessive or prolonged act designed to focus attention upon himself." No further definition of any of those terms is there, which is why the interpretations very so wildly.
I don't think I've ever called it. The only celebrations I've ever flagged were right in an opponent's face. I think we can all agree that you have to step back or get up off the guy before you yell and scream.
In the video, I'd flag it as being prolonged. The DE made a great play and he should be jacked about ti. The first part of his dance, so long as it wasn't directed toward the opponent (and it wasn't) was OK, but he needs to get on with his day. By the time he draws back the invisible bow and fires an arrow, he went over the line.
A comment on the college rule -- I think it's a little ridiculous, but the NCAA rules committee is made up of COACHES. They write the rules how they want it called. Officials are enforcing the rules the coaches write. The SEC, more than any other conference, wants that stuff wiped out of the game. When I first heard about that play, I didn't know which teams were involved but I guessed it was an SEC game. That's the way the coaches there want it called, or else it wouldn't be called like that.
The rule bok does not use the term "excessive celebration." I'm pretty sure that's from college ball and seen on TV. That's OK, it works, but the rule book just says "any delayed, excessive or prolonged act designed to focus attention upon himself." No further definition of any of those terms is there, which is why the interpretations very so wildly.
I don't think I've ever called it. The only celebrations I've ever flagged were right in an opponent's face. I think we can all agree that you have to step back or get up off the guy before you yell and scream.
In the video, I'd flag it as being prolonged. The DE made a great play and he should be jacked about ti. The first part of his dance, so long as it wasn't directed toward the opponent (and it wasn't) was OK, but he needs to get on with his day. By the time he draws back the invisible bow and fires an arrow, he went over the line.
A comment on the college rule -- I think it's a little ridiculous, but the NCAA rules committee is made up of COACHES. They write the rules how they want it called. Officials are enforcing the rules the coaches write. The SEC, more than any other conference, wants that stuff wiped out of the game. When I first heard about that play, I didn't know which teams were involved but I guessed it was an SEC game. That's the way the coaches there want it called, or else it wouldn't be called like that.
Re: Would you flag this?
Some terrible celebrarting and showing off occured a few years ago in a Gretna-Altavista baskeball game. I heard it on the radio that a certain Colonel mooned the crowd at Gretna. That happened the year before the rule was put in that if you took off any part of your uniform off in the gym it would result ina T.
Some terrible celebrarting and showing off occured a few years ago in a Gretna-Altavista baskeball game. I heard it on the radio that a certain Colonel mooned the crowd at Gretna. That happened the year before the rule was put in that if you took off any part of your uniform off in the gym it would result ina T.
Re: Would you flag this?
So are you telling me that mooning a crowd WASN'T a T at that point? I would think that would always have been grounds for dismissal.
There's no rule in football about removing parts of the uniform, but if someone moons the crowd, he's going to be the subject of one of the most unique ejection reports the VHSL has received in a while.
So are you telling me that mooning a crowd WASN'T a T at that point? I would think that would always have been grounds for dismissal.
There's no rule in football about removing parts of the uniform, but if someone moons the crowd, he's going to be the subject of one of the most unique ejection reports the VHSL has received in a while.
Re: Would you flag this?
Reference the mooning, one has to remember this was "Altavista", who has been known to get "home cooking" in basketball many times over the years.
Reference the mooning, one has to remember this was "Altavista", who has been known to get "home cooking" in basketball many times over the years.
Re: Would you flag this?
The guys on the radio saw it. The three refs said they did not see it. This happened on the Hawks floor also.HR6, you know the same group does both schools games. I cannot believe you would think anything like home cooking goes on.
This post was edited on 10/19 8:48 PM by bowlingref
The guys on the radio saw it. The three refs said they did not see it. This happened on the Hawks floor also.HR6, you know the same group does both schools games. I cannot believe you would think anything like home cooking goes on.
This post was edited on 10/19 8:48 PM by bowlingref
