ND-Indiana game proving football fans are the same everywhere

[1MoreHokie]

Post-game discussion in the new 12 team playoff system is now "did they deserve it?" and "blowouts aren't fun" as though UGA didn't just beat TCU two years ago 65-7 for the title or USC didn't pound Oklahoma 55-14 in the BCS system. People fought long and hard to move away from the "unfair" BCA/BCS system towards the playoffs (remember the micro-battles along the way like which polls should/shouldn't be included) and now have battled to expand from a 4 team playoff into a 12 team playoff and yet here we sit, a different year but the same boring, hackneyed arguments. Autobids, SOS discussions, "quality" wins and losses, a constant shuffling of what matters and what suddenly doesn't when it comes to figuring out who reigns supreme.

Reminds me of, well, this board!

"Six divisions is too much"
"Four divisions is too little"
"Eight teams per region is too many"
"Byes are unfair"
"Crossbracketing is the only fair thing"
"Crossbracketing is unfair"

The similarities are striking to me. A ceaseless amount of hemming and hawing from fans to move away from one system with flaws and towards another that also has flaws, a Sisyphean task with no end.

Me? Football is football. More is good, less is worse, it's OK if the first round of the playoffs are mostly blowouts, home field is an illusion at this level, you can only play who is put before you, and the cream always rises.

 

[CountryClubJoesSecretAlias]

Just go back to four. This is awful.

 

[WP02alum]

One game in? What???

 

[m-squared]

ND vs Indiana was a 10 point game. In my opinion that's not a blowout. It wasn't quite as close as the final score but it got a little interesting at the end. Too close to the end to think Indiana had a chance. Need to let it all play out to have a good discussion, but maybe 8 teams would be better. That would provide enough to let the conference champions play and 3 more. That might reduce the "should have been in" discussion. Also coming up with a way that sis objective vs subjective to pick the teams would be best, but I don't know of a good way to do that.

 

[WP02alum]

The Lane Kiffin whining is a bit much. Like, don’t lose to Kentucky, and you’re in!

 

[CountryClubJoesSecretAlias]

ND vs Indiana was a 10 point game. In my opinion that's not a blowout. It wasn't quite as close as the final score but it got a little interesting at the end. Too close to the end to think Indiana had a chance. Need to let it all play out to have a good discussion, but maybe 8 teams would be better. That would provide enough to let the conference champions play and 3 more. That might reduce the "should have been in" discussion. Also coming up with a way that sis objective vs subjective to pick the teams would be best, but I don't know of a good way to do that.

Did you watch? It wasn't close. Notre Dame dominated the trenches. Indiana never shoulda been in there.

 

[WP02alum]

Who instead? I don’t believe there are a ton of viable answers. All the options people float are talented teams, but they earned it less than Indiana with an embarrassing loss within their 3 losses (IMO).

 

[Shruikan]

I agree that football fans in general have serious "grass is greener" syndrome, regardless of the level of play. That said, I'm very excited for the 12-team playoff going forward. If those "undeserving" teams are so bad that they aren't worthy of playing on the same field as the Georgias and Alabamas of the world, they can prove it and rest their starters and treat it as a bye. As for the whiny fans... nothing is forcing them to watch blowouts. The Big 10 commissioner isn't going to come down from the heavens and smite them if they go bowling instead of watching ND/Indiana. They should go do something else with their time if it bothers them so.

Me? I'd much rather watch football even if it's a blowout. Just because a team gets blown out doesn't mean they didn't deserve to be there.

Prior to now, college football was the only major sport where a team could soundly beat everyone on their schedule and not have an opportunity to play for a championship and that's unacceptable. I get the "weak schedule" argument, but there are plenty of times where good G6 teams can't schedule quality opponents because there's little reason for a good P5 team to play a Boise State, Appalachian State, or JMU over a Kennesaw State, Kent State, or FIU. And there's no guarantee a team that looks good when you scheduled them will still be good by the time the game happens 5+ years down the road.

The much bigger issue facing college football is unregulated free agency and the transfer portal being open during bowl season. I'm all for players making money off their labor and I get that there are legal issues preventing the NCAA from regulating it, but something needs to be done. Marshall had to drop out of their bowl after winning a conference championship because they got picked apart, and last year JMU had their entire team taken before their bowl too. That should never happen.

 

[CountryClubJoesSecretAlias]

SMU QB playing like some kid mashing buttons on Madden.

 

[CountryClubJoesSecretAlias]

PSU is not even that good.

 

[BoKnowsSports]

Just go back to four. This is awful.

DUB C 🦁

 

[EPJr]

Just go back to four. This is awful.

you whiners act like you never watched the first round of any tournament.
Blowouts happen
also upsets happen
every other level of football have had a tournament for decades - DECADES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
They are NOT going back to less money, in fact are looking at getting rid of the 1st round byes.

 

[CountryClubJoesSecretAlias]

DUB C 🦁

Testament to the strength of the conference man. Queen City 3A/4A, the old I-Meck 4A, no joke. Glad they got it done for the City.

 

[CountryClubJoesSecretAlias]

you whiners act like you never watched the first round of any tournament.
Blowouts happen
also upsets happen
every other level of football have had a tournament for decades - DECADES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
They are NOT going back to less money, in fact are looking at getting rid of the 1st round byes.

Then get the right teams.

 

[BoKnowsSports]

Testament to the strength of the conference man. Queen City 3A/4A, the old I-Mech 4A, no joke. Glad they got it done for the City.

A few years back I asked TJ McGill and Jordan Thompson did West Charlotte have anything cause I was debating on going to the game when we played them. Both said them boys young but they gonna be tough in a few years but it’s no way anybody could’ve imagine to take this big of a jump. That talent wave they got from Ranson over the past two years is insane. 3A West is just as tough as 4A West.

 

[BoKnowsSports]

@CountryClubJoesSecretAlias people in VA get in their feelings when I tell them that a middle of the pack team in NC would dominate most classifications here. Independence, Charlotte Catholic, Butler, Richmond, Watauga, hell even a Myers Park. It’s different in NC, especially Charlotte.

 

[CountryClubJoesSecretAlias]

NC has had a run of some good classes. '21, '25, '26. Next year's class is deep.

 

[WP02alum]

Then get the right teams.

Which are who?

 

[CountryClubJoesSecretAlias]

Which are who?

This is the way I look at it. If you beat some good teams like Alabama beat Georgia...That shows me you belong at this level, even if you lose a couple you shouldn't because your QB has a bad game or whatever. I know you can compete at this level. I can give you the benefit of the doubt. If you beat up on a bunch of mediocre teams and lose to the only good teams you play like Indiana and SMU, you haven't really shown me anything.

 

[CountryClubJoesSecretAlias]

You only have to watch the first five or six minutes of those games to know that Indiana and SMU were going to have it rough. Watch the lines. They are not physical enough up front to compete at that level.

 

[K7w5]

If a team can go 11-1 in a power conference and not make the 12 team playoff, then there is no point in even playing the regular season. Was Indiana that good? No. But why even play the games if the consensus becomes a team like indiana can’t make the playoff? Just take OSU, Michigan, Oregon, ND, and PSU and 7 SEC teams and make a new division.

Sports are becoming harder to be a fan of because the games are less important on their own and more about spurring discourse. NBA, NFL, CFB, etc. Watching the athletes perform is almost secondary to finding fuel for our ever ongoing arguments about who’s the GOAT? What conference is best? It’s exhausting. Might as well watch FOX or CNN.

 

[mike salem]

More football is better. Refine the selection process.

 

[CountryClubJoesSecretAlias]

Should penalize teams for running out of the gun on the goal line too while we're at it.

 

[1MoreHokie]

People make the mistake of thinking the quality of the game has to match the quality of the teams involved and if it doesn't then the matchup was clearly done improperly. You can have one deserving team destroy another. In 2022, TCU went 12-0 in the regular season, lost by 3 in OT to a top 10 KSU in the Big 12 CCG, beat a 13-0 Michigan in the semis and then promptly got destroyed 65-7 by UGA. Was it a good title game? No, of course not. But TCU deserved to be there.

You're going to get dud playoff games and no amount of tinkering with the matchups will ever stop it. Everyone wants competitive games, sure, but you should have your feet on the ground enough to realize that won't always happen.

 

[CountryClubJoesSecretAlias]

People make the mistake of thinking the quality of the game has to match the quality of the teams involved and if it doesn't then the matchup was clearly done improperly. You can have one deserving team destroy another. In 2022, TCU went 12-0 in the regular season, lost by 3 in OT to a top 10 KSU in the Big 12 CCG, beat a 13-0 Michigan in the semis and then promptly got destroyed 65-7 by UGA. Was it a good title game? No, of course not. But TCU deserved to be there.

You're going to get dud playoff games and no amount of tinkering with the matchups will ever stop it. Everyone wants competitive games, sure, but you should have your feet on the ground enough to realize that won't always happen.

The problem is with the conferences getting bigger you have unbalanced conference schedules. SMU didn't play Miami. They didn't play Syracuse. They didn't play Clemson until the conference championship. I don't know what makes a team like that "deserving." They didn't win their conference. They didn't beat a single team that finished in the top 25. There's going to have to be some type of minimal standard with the conferences being the way they are or you're going to get a lot more games like those first two. I'm just glad no one got seriously hurt. You could tell the Indiana QB was scared for his life.

 

[1MoreHokie]

The problem is with the conferences getting bigger you have unbalanced conference schedules. SMU didn't play Miami. They didn't play Syracuse. They didn't play Clemson until the conference championship. I don't know what makes a team like that "deserving." They didn't win their conference. They didn't beat a single team that finished in the top 25. There's going to have to be some type of minimal standard with the conferences being the way they are or you're going to get a lot more games like those first two. I'm just glad no one got seriously hurt. You could tell the Indiana QB was scared for his life.

You play the teams you're given. When you win a bunch and lose very little, you're rewarded. You're discussing everything with the gift of hindsight. You have a problem now because they lost poorly. Had they won or lose close, you wouldn't have spoken up which is my point entirely. You can't use the outcome of a game that you don't like to make post-hoc justifications about why a team shouldn't be there. Deserving teams will get blown out in games and probably on an annual basis. The CFP gave us 10 years of title games in the 4 team playoff structure. Want to know the scoring breakdown? 3 one score games, 1 two score game (15 points), and the other six were 3 score or more. We had a decade of the most deserving teams and we had blowout after blowout regardless. It simply is what it is.

Parity is only going to continue to grow with NIL. The days of UGA or Bama or OSU stuffing their rosters four-deep with five stars are gone. You pay for what you need, the next team buys what you can't afford and so on. There's only ever going to be more situations where people are going to argue about a 12-1 no name versus a 10-3 blue blood (the 12-1 no name gets the spot, of course, 10-3 teams need to win their games).

 

[CountryClubJoesSecretAlias]

You play the teams you're given. When you win a bunch and lose very little, you're rewarded. You're discussing everything with the gift of hindsight. You have a problem now because they lost poorly. Had they won or lose close, you wouldn't have spoken up which is my point entirely. You can't use the outcome of a game that you don't like to make post-hoc justifications about why a team shouldn't be there. ...

Don't play with me.

 

[WP02alum]

I don’t like the idea of a committee deciding they don’t think a team will compete well enough, despite their record. Let them prove you right or wrong in the tournament. If anything, expand to a full 16 teams so there can be additional 2-3 loss teams included.

I feel like these mega conferences with 16-18 teams need to learn how to take the good with the bad. Oh, you want all that tv revenue? Well then you have to understand your conference schedule might be brutal and you might not make the CFP. That’s the trade off you accepted. Can’t have it both ways.

 

[CountryClubJoesSecretAlias]

I hear what you're saying. The problem is the ACC/Big12/G5 don't have very much leverage. Because they're not on the same level. 11-1, 10-2 is not going to be the same as 11-1, 10-2 in the SEC/B1G. That's why if you want the 12 best teams, you have to look at more than just the win column. If you want the 12 most "deserving" teams or whatever, then maybe there's more of an argument for an SMU, Indiana, etc. Two different things. I would bet they change the format and/or give more weight to SOS.

 

[TDKLIGHTSOUT]

Teams have always been blown out in post season of all sports. Does not mean the team getting blown out didn't deserve a chance in the playoffs. Back in 1995 colleges football season undefeated Nebraska beat down undefeated Florida 62-20 so does that mean the Gators were trash. Nope. The won the national championship with one lost the very next year. The SEC was down this year and anyone watching the games will tell you that. Rewarding 3 lost teams would be insane. I am old enough to remember when losing one game felt like a death blow to your national championship hopes. Take Barry Switzer's Oklahoma teams of the mid 80's they had a 3 year period where they only lost 3 games. All were to Miami and they won only one championship because Miami tanked to Tennessee in the Sugar bowl while they beat number one. Penn State in the Orange. It made regular season games mean more back then when non conference elite teams actually played each other mid season.