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Ugliest game you've ever seen

mike salem

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Nov 2, 2009
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I guess you could interpret this in many different ways, but I was thinking of a game where the 2 teams looked like they wanted to go full UFC mode on one another. The most recent one I can think of is Salem & GW Danville in '14 quarterfinals. I don't think the teams had ever faced each other, but they looked like old rivals. Guys hitting after the whistle, big hits, helmets flying, smack talk, bottom of the pile shenanigans, and fans really amping things up.

Your interpretation of ugly could be a sloppily played game, a weather nightmare, low scoring, 6 OT's, big rivalry, actual fisticuffs, or whatever comes to mind.
 
Anytime Dinwiddie plays Meadowbrook. I usually just pray our guys don't retaliate or engage in extra curricular activities. We used to play tgem the last game of the. season, so the fans dreaded the fact we could lose someone for the playoffs.

One of the hardest hitting games I ever saw was Dinwiddie versus Sherando in 2013. Forget the score both teams unloaded on each other all game. You could hear some of the hits like you were on the field. Just nasty!

Our series with Jamestown a couple of years ago was brutal. Such lopsided games the field almost fell into ocean. In 3 games we outscored them 170-7. Jamestown never gave up, but it was not fun for anyone.
 
2 ugliest games I ever saw were Salem at Richlands the year that they wore the 3/4" cleats (1992 maybe?) and Salem vs Grundy in the 1996 State Semis. Both of those games where played in unplayable conditions.
 
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Dinwiddie at Matoaca, 2006? 64-28 Matoaca. Matoaca never took their starters out. Ugly, as in sportsmanship. Couldn't do much about it that year, but they have paid the fiddler most years since then.
 
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Highland Springs at Meadowbrook last year!! The upset of the year MBK downs #1 ranked HS 8-7, HS managed to drive insided the 10 with just seconds. instead of going for it on 4th down, they missed the go ahead field goal, what would be the only blemish on HS's 2nd straight State Championship run. Finishing the 2016 season 14-1.
2015 HS falls to Hermitage 21-20 OT, 1st game on the way to the 1st State Title since 1961. Finishing the 2015 season 14-1. 2014 HS falls to Bird 25-23 on a Bird interception on what could have been the winning scoring drive. HS finishes the season 11-1.
 
I guess you could interpret this in many different ways, but I was thinking of a game where the 2 teams looked like they wanted to go full UFC mode on one another. The most recent one I can think of is Salem & GW Danville in '14 quarterfinals. I don't think the teams had ever faced each other, but they looked like old rivals. Guys hitting after the whistle, big hits, helmets flying, smack talk, bottom of the pile shenanigans, and fans really amping things up.

Your interpretation of ugly could be a sloppily played game, a weather nightmare, low scoring, 6 OT's, big rivalry, actual fisticuffs, or whatever comes to mind.
Low down ugly game. I know you and I have 2 different opinions of that game, respectfully, but we both agree that it was ugly. I've seen some ugly ones. If you watched Gretna back in 03 and 04 then you saw your fair share of ugly games. I think Christiansburg, William Campbell (thanks to Cedric Peerman), and Graham (with Ahmad Bradshaw) were the only teams to come close to beating them boys. A lot of 55/64/70 to nothing games. It was downright ugly. I recall David Redick (NBA star JJ Redick's little brother and an absolute BEAST at TE..played at Marshall; I think CS beat Salem that year ) and Cave Spring giving them a game until Vic Hall just made them look like an optimist league team in the second half. I'll also say the 2008 GW team played some ugly games...Their one and only bright spot was the legend David Wilson and he singlehandedly led them to the NW region championship where they lost to Bealton. That was the ugliest team I think I've ever seen. No QB, no receivers, just a bunch of undersized/strong lineman and David.
 
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Low down ugly game. I know you and I have 2 different opinions of that game, respectfully, but we both agree that it was ugly. I've seen some ugly ones. If you watched Gretna back in 03 and 04 then you saw your fair share of ugly games. I think Christiansburg, William Campbell (thanks to Cedric Peerman), and Graham (with Ahmad Bradshaw) were the only teams to come close to beating them boys. A lot of 55/64/70 to nothing games. It was downright ugly. I recall David Reddick (NBA star JJ Reddick's little brother and an absolute BEAST at TE..played at Marshall; I think CS beat Salem that year ) and Cave Spring giving them a game until Vic Hall just made them look like an optimist league team in the second half. I'll also say the 2008 GW team played some ugly games...Their one and only bright spot was the legend David Wilson and he lead them to the NW region championship where they lost to Bealton. That was the ugliest team I think I've ever seen. No QB, no receivers, just a bunch of undersized/strong lineman and David.

CS didn't beat Salem when Redick played. The Knights have beaten Salem twice since 1983 - 2001 and 2010. Three times, if one includes the 2000 game that officially stands as a Salem win due to CS later forfeiting for using an ineligible player.

You might be thinking of Christiansburg beating Salem in 2004. The final was 36-35, after Salem blew a 35-14 halftime lead. Salem's young head coach might have learned a valuable lesson about "playing not to lose" that night. That was the Blue Demons' first-ever win over the Spartans, after losing the first fourteen meetings by an average of around 40 points. In other words - a monumental upset.
 
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Highland Springs at Meadowbrook last year!! The upset of the year MBK downs #1 ranked HS 8-7, HS managed to drive insided the 10 with just seconds. instead of going for it on 4th down, they missed the go ahead field goal, what would be the only blemish on HS's 2nd straight State Championship run. Finishing the 2016 season 14-1.
2015 HS falls to Hermitage 21-20 OT, 1st game on the way to the 1st State Title since 1961. Finishing the 2015 season 14-1. 2014 HS falls to Bird 25-23 on a Bird interception on what could have been the winning scoring drive. HS finishes the season 11-1.

Were those actually ugly games, or just heartbreaking losses from HS point of view?
 
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CS didn't beat Salem when Redick played. The Knights have beaten Salem twice since 1983 - 2001 and 2010. Three times, if one includes the 2000 game that officially stands as a Salem win due to CS later forfeiting for using an ineligible player.

You might be thinking of Christiansburg beating Salem in 2004. The final was 36-35, after Salem blew a 35-14 halftime lead. Salem's young head coach might have learned a valuable lesson about "playing not to lose" that night. That was the Blue Demons' first-ever win over the Spartans, after losing the first fourteen meetings by an average of around 40 points. In other words - a monumental upset.
You are correct. 28-21 Salem in 2004. Salem beat them in 2005, 7-6, which was the game I thought CS won.
 
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2 ugliest games I ever saw were Salem at Richlands the year that they wore the 3/4" cleats (1992 maybe?) and Salem vs Grundy in the 1996 State Semis. Both of those games where played in unplayable conditions.

I was at both of those. I agree about the Grundy game, played at Tazewell. Classic cold, non-stop rain in November (cue Guns N' Roses). At least Salem won, and went on to claim state football title number one the next week.

The infamous Richlands game I remember as more frustrating than anything, although the field was undeniably a mess, to put it quite charitably. I still think Salem could have won that game, regardless of whatever went on, and would have won had it been played just about anywhere else on the planet.

About the ugliest Salem game I remember is the last one the Spartans ever played at fabled Victory Stadium, against William Fleming in 2002. The Colonels prevailed 14-6, amidst a veritable flood of Spartan penalties, turnovers, and mental errors. IMHO, that was the worst effort I ever saw from a Willis White-coached team. Fortunately, those kinds of performances were rarer than hens teeth.

Another ugly one from more recent times would be the thrashing endured over at Cave Spring in 2010, to the tune of 34-6. Seth Fisher was lost early on ( for the season, as it turned out), and things got worse from there.

My junior and senior years in high school saw many one-sided losses that would make most pigskin fans shudder and turn away in revulsion. One that stands out is a loss to Pulaski County in 1979, at old Municipal Field in Salem. Again in a downpour. It was Joel Hicks's first real good team, and I think the Cougars prevailed along the lines of 49-7, which was a real butt-kicking back in those days of lower-scoring games. And it really wasn't even that close. Salem's best athlete, who went on to play for VMI, was Jay Brock at halfback (he should have played qb). One of Salem's more successful plays (relatively) during that 3-7 season had been Brock throwing a pass on the halfback option. Things got so humiliating, Salem's coaches felt compelled to try four consecutive halfback option passes in the fourth quarter. Resulting in four incompletions in a row. That, my friends, is U-G-L-Y.

Of course, Salem has been fortunate enough to be on the happy side of many games that a lot of people might consider ugly, especially in the last four seasons. Somehow, those haven't been as miserable to sit through as the ones I mentioned above.
 
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You are correct. 28-21 Salem in 2004. Salem beat them in 2005, 7-6, which was the game I thought CS won.

Most of the non-Salem world claimed that CS got hosed in that game, which might be why that game stands out. Primarily due to a photo being circulated that purported to show the Knights' qb Danny Aiken - who I believe made it to the NFL as a long snapper - holding the ball over the goal line on a two-point conversion attempt in the game's last minute. What the photo failed to show, and what the non-Salem world chose to ignore, was that Aiken had stepped on the sideline before reaching the goal line. It was a nice effort, though.
 
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Most of the non-Salem world claimed that CS got hosed in that game, which might be why that game stands out. Primarily due to a photo being circulated that purported to show the Knights' qb Danny Aiken - who I believe made it to the NFL as a long snapper - holding the ball over the goal line on a two-point conversion attempt in the game's last minute. What the photo failed to show, and what the non-Salem world chose to ignore, was that Aiken had stepped on the sideline before reaching the goal line. It was a nice effort, though.

Speaking of hoses how about Amherst getting it bad at Salem one night? Worst call ive ever seen in my life...guy was at least 5 yards out of bounds and a TD was called...unbelievable

Even the most for hard Salem fans have to admit that call was awful

And I was a neutral fan that might also
 
Speaking of officials. I know this is off topic but, please don't get started on the officials costing teams games. Lol DP and I have already heard enough side talk about how "you have to beat Salem and the refs", "better beat Salem bad or you dont stand a chance", and the best one yet "the whole ref crew will be former Salem or Andrew Lewis guys".

This type of talk is usually propaganda and bs. The Dinwiddie vs. Salem game should be a good one. I personally expect the Roanoke Officials group to put their best crew on this game. They may favor Salem to some degree, but most officials call it down the middle and like a good game. Since these two teams played for the state championship last season the Roanoke refs know big brother will be watching. A job well done means future playoff assignments for the assigned crew.

I know I brought it up, but for you GW Danville and EC Glass alumni be careful. People felt the same way about coming to your house in thev1970's and 1980's. Good teams always hear it. Its usually just an excuse for getting beat. Heck, if Salem plays penalty free, and perfect football like they did in November my Generals will have a tough night anyway.
 
Fact check me Spartan.. In 05, didn't Amherst come into Salem and lose on a controversial play in the playoffs? I know there was a lot of video circulating around showing that the Amherst receiver caught the ball in bounds, whereas the officials ruled it was incomplete.
 
Speaking of officials. I know this is off topic but, please don't get started on the officials costing teams games. Lol DP and I have already heard enough side talk about how "you have to beat Salem and the refs", "better beat Salem bad or you dont stand a chance", and the best one yet "the whole ref crew will be former Salem or Andrew Lewis guys".

This type of talk is usually propaganda and bs. The Dinwiddie vs. Salem game should be a good one. I personally expect the Roanoke Officials group to put their best crew on this game. They may favor Salem to some degree, but most officials call it down the middle and like a good game. Since these two teams played for the state championship last season the Roanoke refs know big brother will be watching. A job well done means future playoff assignments for the assigned crew.

I know I brought it up, but for you GW Danville and EC Glass alumni be careful. People felt the same way about coming to your house in thev1970's and 1980's. Good teams always hear it. Its usually just an excuse for getting beat. Heck, if Salem plays penalty free, and perfect football like they did in November my Generals will have a tough night anyway.
The two worst officiated places I've seen is John Handley for basketball and Salem for football... Danville and Lynchburg refs are pretty biased as well so that statement about Glass and GW still hold true. I've seen (with my own eyes) Salem get beat at home twice by Magna Vista and Christiansburg.. WB also beat them back in 13. Up at John Handley, you can forget it lol maybe their basketball refs should officiate their football games ;)
 
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Fact check me Spartan.. In 05, didn't Amherst come into Salem and lose on a controversial play in the playoffs? I know there was a lot of video circulating around showing that the Amherst receiver caught the ball in bounds, whereas the officials ruled it was incomplete.

It's been a while but I think it's the opposite...a Salem receiver caught ball well out of bounds and ruled a TD

I could be mistaken though
 
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Were those actually ugly games, or just heartbreaking losses from HS point of view?
Granted! Then MBK games was ugly!!!!!! The other 2 were just heartbreaking. HS has had some gross ugly games against Armstrong. 2014 and '16, consecutively 72-0 and 73-0. They didn't even want to play our JV. They forfeited ....
We have taken them off of our schedule this year.
 
Ah yes......"The Call" from the '05 Amherst County playoff game. The one play that fans from other schools love to trot out as indisputable proof that Salem always cheats for everything it ever wins. Thanks for bringing that up; it's probably been a few months, so it was overdue to be discussed again.

Yes - there was a highly controversial call with about 1:50 left to play in regulation. Actually, it wasn't even that controversial - it was unarguably the worst call I've ever seen in a game in person, and one of the two or three worst overall, including games I've seen on TV. I've never heard any Salem fan dispute that fact. It was an inexcusably horrendous call. Salem's Tony Spradlin made a great diving catch, but landed about three (not five) yards out of bounds. No part of his body was close to landing in play. Yet, the official ruled it a touchdown.

No - Amherst did not lose the game on that play. Here are the facts that most people, particularly Amherst County fans, choose to omit, as they don't fit the narrative:
~That bad call moved the score to 14-13, Amherst. Salem still had to kick the extra point to tie, and as any of you who have ever watched a high school game on a frozen November night know, that is far from being automatic.
~There was still 1:50 left on the clock after Salem tied the score at 14.
~Amherst had at least one timeout left, maybe two.
~Amherst had an excellent kicker; might have been all-state (not sure on that detail).
~After failing to score in the last 1:50, Amherst still had every chance to win in overtime.

Let's recap - Amherst County had 1:50 left, the capability to stop the clock, an outstanding kicker, and all they needed was a field goal to win. When the game went to overtime, Amherst still had their fair shot with the ball, and all they managed to do was false start on their own field goal attempt (and there was no disputing that call). It's my own opinion that Amherst failed so miserably after the blown call because their head coach, usually supremely cool and confident, completely lost his sh*t, and his team followed suit. Understandable for a minute or two, but Abell totally lost sight of the fact that he still had a winnable game. At some point, you've got to show the kids that yes, terrible breaks may come your way, but you can still overcome.

Also, for all you conspiracy theorists, the guy who made the horrendous call in the first place wasn't a Salem or Andrew Lewis guy. His last name was Foutz, and his brother was the head coach at Cave Spring. Our hated rival from Roanoke County, where Salem is roundly despised. So, I doubt Mr. Foutz was looking to do the Spartans any favors. He certainly didn't, in the long run.

To be quite honest, I fervently wish he had just made the correct call to begin with. Salem was the better team, and probably would have won anyway. Even if they hadn't, we wouldn't have seen the resulting rise of the "Salem Cheats!!" cottage industry that thrived for the next few years after that game (especially on this very website), and lives on to this day in all the "better make sure you beat them by four TD's" and "worst place for officiating" type of comments.

Hey, you wanna beat Salem at Salem Stadium? Here's a tip: don't come in more concerned with talking trash and taking players out of the game than with making football plays. I, with my own eyes, have seen Salem lose plenty of home games. I saw William Byrd - who has nowhere near the overall talent that GW is claimed to possess on a yearly basis - win in Salem five times out of eleven tries, from '93 to '13. If Byrd can be focused and disciplined enough to do it, maybe the more talented teams can, too?

Just a little postscript to that '05 debacle: the very next season, Amherst County returned to Salem Stadium for the regional championship. The Lancers faced a worse situation than they had the previous year. There was less than 1:30 to play, Amherst needed a TD to go ahead, and had nearly eighty yards to cover. Less time, more yards, worse score than in '05. And yet, despite the fact that "you'll always get cheated in Salem", they got it done, and won the damn game. Amherst won, 25-20.

Sorry to go on so long on this matter. This is the first time I've ever fully responded to all the crap written and said about that long-ago night. It just gets to be a bit much, you know? I'm sure what I've said will tick off a lot of people, particularly our Amherst friends. So be it. All I ask is that the rest of you all read the facts, and then tell me how one play with 1:50 left decided the game.
 
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Ah yes......"The Call" from the '05 Amherst County playoff game. The one play that fans from other schools love to trot out as indisputable proof that Salem always cheats for everything it ever wins. Thanks for bringing that up; it's probably been a few months, so it was overdue to be discussed again.

Yes - there was a highly controversial call with about 1:50 left to play in regulation. Actually, it wasn't even that controversial - it was unarguably the worst call I've ever seen in a game in person, and one of the two or three worst overall, including games I've seen on TV. I've never heard any Salem fan dispute that fact. It was an inexcusably horrendous call. Salem's Tony Spradlin made a great diving catch, but landed about three (not five) yards out of bounds. No part of his body was close to landing in play. Yet, the official ruled it a touchdown.

No - Amherst did not lose the game on that play. Here are the facts that most people, particularly Amherst County fans, choose to omit, as they doesn't fit the narrative:
~That bad call moved the score to 14-13, Amherst. Salem still had to kick the extra point to tie, and as any of you who have ever watched a high school game on a frozen November night know, that is far from being automatic.
~There was still 1:50 left on the clock after Salem tied the score at 14.
~Amherst had at least one timeout left, maybe two.
~Amherst had an excellent kicker; might have been all-state (not sure on that detail).
~After failing to score in the last 1:50, Amherst still had every chance to win in overtime.

Let's recap - Amherst County had 1:50 left, the capability to stop the clock, an outstanding kicker, and all they needed was a field goal to win. When the game went to overtime, Amherst still had their fair shot with the ball, and all they managed to do was false start on their own field goal attempt (and there was no disputing that call). It's my own opinion that Amherst failed so miserably after the blown call because their head coach, usually supremely cool and confident, completely lost his sh*t, and his team followed suit. Understandable for a minute or two, but Abell totally lost sight of the fact that he still had a winnable game. At some point, you've got to show the kids that yes, terrible breaks may come your way, but you can still overcome.

Also, for all you conspiracy theorists, the guy who made the horrendous call in the first place wasn't a Salem or Andrew Lewis guy. His last name was Foutz, and his brother was the head coach at Cave Spring. Our hated rival from Roanoke County, where Salem is roundly despised. So, I doubt Mr. Foutz was looking to do the Spartans any favors. He certainly didn't, in the long run.

To be quite honest, I fervently wish he had just made the correct call to begin with. Salem was the better team, and probably would have won anyway. Even if they hadn't, we wouldn't have seen the resulting rise of the "Salem Cheats!!" cottage industry that thrived for the next few years after that game (especially on this very website), and lives on to this day in all the "better make sure you beat them by four TD's" and "worst place for officiating" type of comments.

Hey, you wanna beat Salem at Salem Stadium? Here's a tip: don't come in more concerned with talking trash and taking players out of the game than with making football plays. I, with my own eyes, have seen Salem lose plenty of home games. I saw William Byrd - who has nowhere near the overall talent that GW is claimed to possess on a yearly basis - win in Salem five times out of eleven tries, from '93 to '13. If Byrd can be focused and disciplined enough to do it, maybe the more talented teams can, too?

Just a little postscript to that '05 debacle: the very next season, Amherst County returned to Salem Stadium for the regional championship. The Lancers faced a worse situation than they had the previous year. There was less than 1:30 to play, Amherst needed a TD to go ahead, and had nearly eighty yards to cover. Less time, more yards, worse score than in '05. And yet, despite the fact that "you'll always get cheated in Salem", they got it done, and won the damn game. Amherst won, 25-20.

Sorry to go on so long on this matter. This is the first time I've ever fully responded to all the crap written and said about that long-ago night. It just gets to be a bit much, you know? I'm sure what I've said will tick off a lot of people, particularly our Amherst friends. So be it. All I ask is that the rest of you all read the facts, and then tell me how one play with 1:50 left decided the game.

I never said anything about Salem getting all the calls and that BS I was just pointing out the worst call ive ever seen in my life

My team isn't even D4 so I don't care who gets the calls there and who don't...and I respect salem
 
To pick on the Salem refs, I never will forget the play where Hunter Byrnes from GW threw an intermediate pass to Malik Clements. Clements catches the ball and makes some beautiful moves and gets a first down.. The Salem linejudge placed the ball 3 yards behind the chains :confused:.. GW faces a 3rd and 3 and gets sacked.. Salem has great field position and scores. It's all over and done with.. Truth is.. The NY Giants could've won West that year and wouldn't have beaten Lake Taylor lol

Note: there's no ill will directed here. I'm enjoying this thread so let's be respectful to one another .
 
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To pick on the Salem refs, I never will forget the play where Hunter Byrnes from GW threw an intermediate pass to Malik Clements. Clements catches the ball and makes some beautiful moves and gets a first down.. The Salem linejudge placed the ball 3 yards behind the chains :confused:.. GW faces a 3rd and 3 and gets sacked.. Salem has great field position and scores. It's all over and done with.. Truth is.. The NY Giants could've won West that year and wouldn't have beaten Lake Taylor lol

Note: there's no ill will directed here. I'm enjoying this thread so let's be respectful to one another .

Yes......let's absolutely be respectful as we say that Salem is the worst place for football officiating. Were all those "Salem refs" actually from the city of Salem? I don't remember that. I just remember they missed GW blatantly having twelve men on the field when they scored their final TD to close the margin from 49-21 to 49-28. You know - not as close as the score would indicate.

This is an enjoyable thread!
 
I never said anything about Salem getting all the calls and that BS I was just pointing out the worst call ive ever seen in my life

My team isn't even D4 so I don't care who gets the calls there and who don't...and I respect salem

And I agreed with you concerning that call.
 
Yes......let's absolutely be respectful as we say that Salem is the worst place for football officiating. Were all those "Salem refs" actually from the city of Salem? I don't remember that. I just remember they missed GW blatantly having twelve men on the field when they scored their final TD to close the margin from 49-21 to 49-28. You know - not as close as the score would indicate.

This is an enjoyable thread!
Correct me if I'm wrong Spartan but wasn't the game 28-21 midway through the 3rd quarter? 35-21 mid way through the 4th when GW was driving in Salem's red zone when Ramsey stripped it and ran it back for a strip six?.. It was striking distance the whole game, to take my boy's defense.. However, that was 3 years ago and just funny to look back on. It may be in bad taste to say that Salem is the worst place to play but I do recall saying Danville and Lynchburg officiating is biased as well. Didn't mean to offend anyone.
 
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People blame the refs because it's easier than admitting their own team couldn't get it done when it mattered most. Law of averages applies to ref calls, people just don't notice "bad" calls that go in their favor and store them in their memories because to them it didn't affect the outcome. You've never left the stadium after a win and turned to your friend and said "thank god they called DPI on ___, kept us in the game". To you the DPI was just a natural part of the game and your team won because it was the better team.

But mostly it's just easier to look outward than inward when bad things happen. It's always someone else's fault.
 
Correct me if I'm wrong Spartan but wasn't the game 28-21 midway through the 3rd quarter? 35-21 mid way through the 4th when GW was driving in Salem's red zone when Ramsey stripped it and ran it back for a strip six?.. It was striking distance the whole game, to take my boy's defense.. However, that was 3 years ago and just funny to look back on. It may be in bad taste to say that Salem is the worst place to play but I do recall saying Danville and Lynchburg officiating is biased as well. Didn't mean to offend anyone.
I will just say if the GW defense could have stopped Alex Ramsey then the outcome could have been different. He was an unstoppable beast scoring 6 TD's that day. Byrnes and Clements were an impressive duo, but the outcome really boiled down to running the ball and controlling the clock.
 
Granted! Then MBK games was ugly!!!!!! The other 2 were just heartbreaking. HS has had some gross ugly games against Armstrong. 2014 and '16, consecutively 72-0 and 73-0. They didn't even want to play our JV. They forfeited ....
We have taken them off of our schedule this year.
I guess almost everybody has their Armstrong. Colonial Heights has been that team in the Central District for about a decade. But that should improve some with a new coach and a new emphasis on football by the Colonials.

As Navy mentioned, Jamestown was just down right super ugly for us. And Caroline was no better. Both are no longer on our schedule.

I guess almost every game with Carrol County gets ugly, quickly, too?
 
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I will just say if the GW defense could have stopped Alex Ramsey then the outcome could have been different. He was an unstoppable beast scoring 6 TD's that day. Byrnes and Clements were an impressive duo, but the outcome really boiled down to running the ball and controlling the clock.

A highly academic point, as GW didn't come remotely close at any point in the game to stopping Ramsey. One could also argue that the game would have been even worse than it was if Coleman Fox hadn't gotten his ankle twisted at the bottom of the pile on the first play from scrimmage.
 
I guess almost everybody has their Armstrong. Colonial Heights has been that team in the Central District for about a decade. But that should improve some with a new coach and a new emphasis on football by the Colonials.

As Navy mentioned, Jamestown was just down right super ugly for us. And Caroline was no better. Both are no longer on our schedule.

I guess almost every game with Carrol County gets ugly, quickly, too?

The first time Salem played CC, the Cavs actually kept it respectable well into the third quarter. Salem had the ball for the first eight or nine minutes, then lost a fumble at Carroll's one yard line. That helped CC's cause considerably.

They're off Salem's schedule too, thank goodness.
 
People blame the refs because it's easier than admitting their own team couldn't get it done when it mattered most. Law of averages applies to ref calls, people just don't notice "bad" calls that go in their favor and store them in their memories because to them it didn't affect the outcome. You've never left the stadium after a win and turned to your friend and said "thank god they called DPI on ___, kept us in the game". To you the DPI was just a natural part of the game and your team won because it was the better team.

But mostly it's just easier to look outward than inward when bad things happen. It's always someone else's fault.
Hey, when a bad call goes your way, it ain't a bad call! Just kidding.

There may be some refs that are not as good as we would like, but there are very few that out and out try to affect the outcome. (We say one at a Prince George game a few years ago.)And if they do, as in depth as the association's evaluations are these days, they are not around very long. And I'll add this, every official, and with no acceptions, every officials that I have had dealings with were nothing but professional.

And my two favorites, (mainly because I have had a lot of private conversations with them), are White Hat and Bleeding Navy. Navy doesn't do football, but I can tell all of you, the integrity he brings to athletics is second to none. (Now that I've gotten that out there, it's time to go back to ragging on him.)
 
Spartan, I've heard a little over the years about why CC is so bad. What is your take?
 
I will just say if the GW defense could have stopped Alex Ramsey then the outcome could have been different. He was an unstoppable beast scoring 6 TD's that day. Byrnes and Clements were an impressive duo, but the outcome really boiled down to running the ball and controlling the clock.
Salem's offensive line was too good. Best line in that state that year. Ramsey could've singlehandedly beat the Chicago Bears that day!
 
Spartan, I've heard a little over the years about why CC is so bad. What is your take?

Not a Salem guy but from what I hear from a buddy that lives in CC is that the county is so large that kids have a long way home after school/practice and plus a bunch of the guys families have farm land that most have to work in when free time allows

This may or may not be reasons just saying what a friend has told me in the past
 
Spartan, I've heard a little over the years about why CC is so bad. What is your take?

Rural county with lower levels of resources; minimal community support; generally small talent pool; poor coaching; significant issues faced by the community, such as drug traffic/abuse.

In spite of all their significant challenges, Carroll County has had decent teams in the past. In 2003, the Cavs lost 3-0 to Magna Vista in the Region IV, Div. 4 title game. To my knowledge, that's as close as they've ever come to the state semis in football. From 1999 to 2010, except for a couple of years, the Cavs were generally competitive under Tom Hale. Over the last five or six seasons, Carroll County's program has plummeted to inclusion among the state's worst at all classifications.
 
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Not a Salem guy but from what I hear from a buddy that lives in CC is that the county is so large that kids have a long way home after school/practice and plus a bunch of the guys families have farm land that most have to work in when free time allows

This may or may not be reasons just saying what a friend has told me in the past
I'm sure that is part of it. I've heard people talk about the travel issues in Franklin County. And I'm sure there are more than one farm boy that just has to get home and help.

Up until the late 80's, kids in Dinwiddie, (and other Southside VA schools), having to go straight home after school to help with tobacco was common. Mexicans, technology, and the discontinuation of tobacco allotments pretty much ended this obstacle.
 
Not a Salem guy but from what I hear from a buddy that lives in CC is that the county is so large that kids have a long way home after school/practice and plus a bunch of the guys families have farm land that most have to work in when free time allows

This may or may not be reasons just saying what a friend has told me in the past

I understand you're just reporting what you've heard, and I'm not trying to be argumentative. However, I've never really bought the "too far from home" excuse. There are plenty of other rural counties around the state in similar circumstances to Carroll County that manage to field good, even excellent football teams almost every year. Dinwiddie, for one notable example. As I stated in the post above, Carroll has been decent in football in the past, and travel to/from school was an issue that they overcame, then.

I don't discount it completely as a factor, but I think travel time to and from school serves more as a convenient excuse once things start going off the rails.
 
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Rural county with lower levels of resources; minimal community support; generally small talent pool; poor coaching; significant issues faced by the community, such as drug traffic/abuse.

In spite of all their significant challenges, Carroll County has had decent teams in the past. In 2003, the Cavs lost 3-0 to Magna Vista in the Region IV, Div. 4 title game. To my knowledge, that's as close as they've ever come to the state semis in football. From 1999 to 2010, except for a couple of years, the Cavs were generally competitive under Tom Hale. Over the last five or six seasons, Carroll County's program has plummeted to inclusion among the state's worst at all classifications.

I know you know my daughter works in the hospital in Galax. (ICU) EVERY time we talk about how her shift was, there is a story or two about a patient with a drug abuse crisis. And more adults than kids. It is beyond the crisis mode out that way. Sad, sad, sad.

I don't know how much a decent CC football program could help the community, but it sure couldn't hurt. You would think the school administration would see this.
 
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I know you know my daughter works in the hospital in Galax. (ICU) EVERY time we talk about how her shift was, there is a story or two about a patient with a drug abuse crisis. And more adults than kids. It is beyond the crisis mode out that way. Sad, sad, sad.

I don't know how much a decent CC football program could help the community, but it sure couldn't hurt. You would think the school administration would see this.

I remember reading an article in the Roanoke Times probably ten years ago about how tiny, rural Galax, of all places, was one of the major drug hubs in the mid-Atlantic region. Hopefully that condition has improved a bit since that article came out.
 
Ah yes......"The Call" from the '05 Amherst County playoff game. The one play that fans from other schools love to trot out as indisputable proof that Salem always cheats for everything it ever wins. Thanks for bringing that up; it's probably been a few months, so it was overdue to be discussed again.

Yes - there was a highly controversial call with about 1:50 left to play in regulation. Actually, it wasn't even that controversial - it was unarguably the worst call I've ever seen in a game in person, and one of the two or three worst overall, including games I've seen on TV. I've never heard any Salem fan dispute that fact. It was an inexcusably horrendous call. Salem's Tony Spradlin made a great diving catch, but landed about three (not five) yards out of bounds. No part of his body was close to landing in play. Yet, the official ruled it a touchdown.

No - Amherst did not lose the game on that play. Here are the facts that most people, particularly Amherst County fans, choose to omit, as they doesn't fit the narrative:
~That bad call moved the score to 14-13, Amherst. Salem still had to kick the extra point to tie, and as any of you who have ever watched a high school game on a frozen November night know, that is far from being automatic.
~There was still 1:50 left on the clock after Salem tied the score at 14.
~Amherst had at least one timeout left, maybe two.
~Amherst had an excellent kicker; might have been all-state (not sure on that detail).
~After failing to score in the last 1:50, Amherst still had every chance to win in overtime.

Let's recap - Amherst County had 1:50 left, the capability to stop the clock, an outstanding kicker, and all they needed was a field goal to win. When the game went to overtime, Amherst still had their fair shot with the ball, and all they managed to do was false start on their own field goal attempt (and there was no disputing that call). It's my own opinion that Amherst failed so miserably after the blown call because their head coach, usually supremely cool and confident, completely lost his sh*t, and his team followed suit. Understandable for a minute or two, but Abell totally lost sight of the fact that he still had a winnable game. At some point, you've got to show the kids that yes, terrible breaks may come your way, but you can still overcome.

Also, for all you conspiracy theorists, the guy who made the horrendous call in the first place wasn't a Salem or Andrew Lewis guy. His last name was Foutz, and his brother was the head coach at Cave Spring. Our hated rival from Roanoke County, where Salem is roundly despised. So, I doubt Mr. Foutz was looking to do the Spartans any favors. He certainly didn't, in the long run.

To be quite honest, I fervently wish he had just made the correct call to begin with. Salem was the better team, and probably would have won anyway. Even if they hadn't, we wouldn't have seen the resulting rise of the "Salem Cheats!!" cottage industry that thrived for the next few years after that game (especially on this very website), and lives on to this day in all the "better make sure you beat them by four TD's" and "worst place for officiating" type of comments.

Hey, you wanna beat Salem at Salem Stadium? Here's a tip: don't come in more concerned with talking trash and taking players out of the game than with making football plays. I, with my own eyes, have seen Salem lose plenty of home games. I saw William Byrd - who has nowhere near the overall talent that GW is claimed to possess on a yearly basis - win in Salem five times out of eleven tries, from '93 to '13. If Byrd can be focused and disciplined enough to do it, maybe the more talented teams can, too?

Just a little postscript to that '05 debacle: the very next season, Amherst County returned to Salem Stadium for the regional championship. The Lancers faced a worse situation than they had the previous year. There was less than 1:30 to play, Amherst needed a TD to go ahead, and had nearly eighty yards to cover. Less time, more yards, worse score than in '05. And yet, despite the fact that "you'll always get cheated in Salem", they got it done, and won the damn game. Amherst won, 25-20.

Sorry to go on so long on this matter. This is the first time I've ever fully responded to all the crap written and said about that long-ago night. It just gets to be a bit much, you know? I'm sure what I've said will tick off a lot of people, particularly our Amherst friends. So be it. All I ask is that the rest of you all read the facts, and then tell me how one play with 1:50 left decided the game.
I will need to correct you just a bit on that play... it actually wasn't a touchdown play at all. It was a an intermediate throw for a first down near midfield. It was a horrible call but Amherst still had chances to stop them and didn't afterwards.

The worst officiating I have ever seen in high school football was 2004 Salem at Christiansburg. Salem, the least penalized team in the state that year, had 4x more penalties and yards than they had in any other game that season. Made up penalties, huge mistakes and just awful game-changing calls the entire game. Tony Spradlin (Funny that he is mentioned again) actually got hit after fair catching a punt and they threw a flag on Cburg on the play but marched the yardage the wrong way and Salem LOST 15 yards and then Spradlin got a PF penalty for yelling at the official for not knowing what he was doing. Instead of being up 15 yards, they were BACK 30 yards from where the punt was caught. None of the individual calls were as bad as the 2005 Salem Amherst game but it was easily the worst I have ever seen for an entire game.
 
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