IF we still had East/West 16 team playoffs

[Gunz41]

East:

1. Nottoway
2. Central Woodstock
3. King William
4. Stuarts Draft
5. Clarke County
6. Strasburg
7. Buckingham
8. Poquoson
9. Brunswick
10. Thomas Jefferson
11. Amelia
12. Greensville
13. East Rockingham
14. Luray
15. Randolph Henry
16. Madison County

1st Round:

16 Madison County at 1 Nottoway
15 Randolph Henry at 2 Central Woodstock
14 Luray at 3 King William
13 East Rockingham at 4 Stuarts Draft
12 Greensville at 5 Clarke County
11 Amelia at 6 Strasburg
10 Thomas Jefferson at 7 Buckingham
9 Brunswick at 8 Poquoson

West:


1. Graham
2. Glenvar
3. Appomattox
4. Virginia
5. Union
6. Central
7. Radford
8. Ridgeview
9. Richlands
10. James River
11. Martinsville
12. Floyd County
13. Tazewell
14. Gretna
15. Lee
16. Gate City

16 Gate City at 1 Graham
15 Lee at Glenvar
14 Gretna at Appomattox
13 Tazewell at Virginia
12 Floyd County at Union
11 Martinsville at 6 Central Wise
10 James River at Radford
9 Richlands at 8 Ridgeview

 

[oldfool2]

We all basically knew several weeks ago region D was going to seed teams different from others this year. I personnally suspected that was politically motivated to ensure a certain school a playoff berth, wonder if it was and if doing something funky in region A was motivated with same reasoning. It's hard to believe this was done in an effort to actually bring out the best team in their region to play for State Championship.

 

[Foosballer]

Thank goodness we don't, we'd be broke from buying gas!

 

[NNDman]

I totally agree with that statement! Region A created their system in the spring I was told. Can't tell you if that's fact or fiction.

 

[Fairlawncat]

I totally agree with that statement! Region A created their system in the spring I was told. Can't tell you if that's fact or fiction.

This is true. I have a couple of friends I played with at William and Mary who are still living in/from Poquoson and one of my buds recently email the Poquoson AD, and the AD responded to his email. What I'm told is, the system absolutely WAS voted on in the spring and it is/was absolutely a one year thing due to Covid. It's not permanent and that next year, Region A would go back to the old format. However, it sounded as if Poquoson was taken back a bit by HOW the regional ranking/winning percentage thing was scored. Their AD seemed to be a bit surprised with the 6 seed after having the 3rd ranked power ranking, but he seemed very positive from what I'm told. Meaning, he kind of gave the benefit of the doubt to the system and told my bud they just came up short, but that it's only a one year thing. Additionally, all the schools DID agree to this system in the spring according to their AD.

My personal thought and my friends echo's the same..........the schools might not have realized how much weight was being placed on the winning percentage and regional ranking thing, and likely, they thought their VHSL power rating would probably parallel their playoff seeding.

 

[Union_Fan]

We all basically knew several weeks ago region D was going to seed teams different from others this year. I personnally suspected that was politically motivated to ensure a certain school a playoff berth, wonder if it was and if doing something funky in region A was motivated with same reasoning. It's hard to believe this was done in an effort to actually bring out the best team in their region to play for State Championship.

According to the Marion HS principal, in a BHC article, the Reg D format was decided in August to counter the loss of games due to Covid.

The same 8 teams got in that would have gotten in under the traditional PP system.

 

[Union_Fan]

Thank goodness we don't, we'd be broke from buying gas!

You're not kidding! Lot of needless travel, even though I really liked playing different teams.

I would like to see a cross bracket of C/D and A/B for the quarter finals

#1D hosts #2C, #1C hosts #2D, same for A/B.

Then highest PP remaining team hosts C/D semifinal and A/B semifinal.

 

[GrahamHighGmen]

We all basically knew several weeks ago region D was going to seed teams different from others this year. I personnally suspected that was politically motivated to ensure a certain school a playoff berth, wonder if it was and if doing something funky in region A was motivated with same reasoning. It's hard to believe this was done in an effort to actually bring out the best team in their region to play for State Championship.

You are right and here's why. Let me be honest, Gate City has put a lot of hurt on a lot of teams in this area in football for 60 years, and yes, Gate City has a reputation by some, not all, but some to be a little "red around the collar." This means, they actually do have a few enemies, or to put it better, there are quite a few "dislikes" coming their way. Gate City should leave the M7 and go back to its original home, the SWD. Gate City is about to be good again very soon. They have an undefeated 8th grade team that has absolutely smashed opponents. They have a bunch of young talent coming up. They are 3 years away when those 8th graders are juniors to being a deep playoff run contender again. Graham and Gate City is an old SWD rivalry. I would love to see it again.

No offense to Abingdon.....well, I take it back.....offense to Abingdon. They are a chicken sh* at times.....not always, but at times. They've avoided Graham like the plague over the years and even closer, on I-81 to much of the SWD, you can forget about them going to the SWD. They want no part of Graham (at least historically, since about 1990). Could that have changed? Sure, it could have, but they are much more aligned with the M7 than the SWD, and Gate City, even though in the heart of the M7 area, is more of a historical or cultural fit with the SWD than the M7. Only my opinion on this here. I'm sure there are those who hold a 100% opposite viewpoint.

 

[GrahamHighGmen]

According to the Marion HS principal, in a BHC article, the Reg D format was decided in August to counter the loss of games due to Covid.

The same 8 teams got in that would have gotten in under the traditional PP system.

That's true, but it wasn't by intention. It happened that way by accident. Also, the playoff seedings and first round matchups would look entirely different if they were seeded by power rating. The only game in round one that would have been the same is Graham vs Lee. The other three first round games would look entirely different. A team like Va High, the overall 2nd ranked power ranked team would be hosting in game one, and if they were to win game one, they would be hosting in game two.

 

[BigWinners]

You are right and here's why. Let me be honest, Gate City has put a lot of hurt on a lot of teams in this area in football for 60 years, and yes, Gate City has a reputation by some, not all, but some to be a little "red around the collar." This means, they actually do have a few enemies, or to put it better, there are quite a few "dislikes" coming their way. Gate City should leave the M7 and go back to its original home, the SWD. Gate City is about to be good again very soon. They have an undefeated 8th grade team that has absolutely smashed opponents. They have a bunch of young talent coming up. They are 3 years away when those 8th graders are juniors to being a deep playoff run contender again. Graham and Gate City is an old SWD rivalry. I would love to see it again.

No offense to Abingdon.....well, I take it back.....offense to Abingdon. They are a chicken sh* at times.....not always, but at times. They've avoided Graham like the plague over the years and even closer, on I-81 to much of the SWD, you can forget about them going to the SWD. They want no part of Graham (at least historically, since about 1990). Could that have changed? Sure, it could have, but they are much more aligned with the M7 than the SWD, and Gate City, even though in the heart of the M7 area, is more of a historical or cultural fit with the SWD than the M7. Only my opinion on this here. I'm sure there are those who hold a 100% opposite viewpoint.

You're overstating the dislike of GC. May have been true at one time but they fit perfectly in the M7 and I would wager would never consider a move. Gate City has way more history with Big Stone, Appalachia, Abingdon and Battle than they do with Graham or Tazwell. GC played Graham 35 times, Tazwell 30. GC played PV 44 times and Appalachia 45 times and that doesn't include the games v. BSG or ESG before PV was founded in the 50s nor is it adding in the games v. Union. Played Abingdon 44 times, JSB 42. Richlands has an argument, playing 52 games, but GC is where it belongs. Ask anyone from GC who they consider more of a rivalry with, Graham or Union. GC was historically a bigger school so sure they didn't play as many playoff games against Burton or Pound, but they were off and on LPD members and now a founding M7 member. Richlands/GC is a big rivalry, but especially in more recent years, in other sports GC has built some big time rivalries with schools like Wise.

 

[Union_Fan]

Also, GC was in the LPD before they were in the SWD.

I remember seeing old year books from Appy, and GC was playing them and BSG in the 1930s. Graham doesn't appear on a GC schedule until 1960.

 

[Union_Fan]

That's true, but it wasn't by intention. It happened that way by accident. Also, the playoff seedings and first round matchups would look entirely different if they were seeded by power rating. The only game in round one that would have been the same is Graham vs Lee. The other three first round games would look entirely different. A team like Va High, the overall 2nd ranked power ranked team would be hosting in game one, and if they were to win game one, they would be hosting in game two.

The 1st RD games would have been different for sure, but not getting a home game isn't as bad as not getting a playoff game at all.

Hopefully, things will be normal next year.

 

[ClarkeFan83]

Hopefully, things will be normal next year.

They will be. There was an election.

 

[EPJr]

They will be. There was an election.

I don't think you want to go there on a high school sports forum!

 

[Gridiron1960]

According to the Marion HS principal, in a BHC article, the Reg D format was decided in August to counter the loss of games due to Covid.

The same 8 teams got in that would have gotten in under the traditional PP system.

Therein lies the problem. 1A games should not get the same as 2A games. You’re rewarding schools who choose to play a weaker schedule. I.E. Lee High playing East Mont & Rye Cove while Gate City played Radford & Richlands. Gate City beat Lee & finished above them in the district yet Lee got in while Gate City did not. We have a flawed system on some levels.

 

[Gunz41]

Therein lies the problem. 1A games should not get the same as 2A games. You’re rewarding schools who choose to play a weaker schedule. I.E. Lee High playing East Mont & Rye Cove while Gate City played Radford & Richlands. Gate City beat Lee & finished above them in the district yet Lee got in while Gate City did not. We have a flawed system on some levels.

That's a little tough to say instead of a case by case basis.

Shenandoah (4 3a, 1 2a, 2 1a). It's not as black and white as it is down in SWVA.

The system was done so that smaller schools (2a included) can actually fill a schedule. Do you think Tazewell last 2 years, Glenvar, Lord Botetourt, etc. would actually schedule Riverheads in another scenario?

 

[RedPrideNation_RollPride]

It’s not clear cut in SWVA either or there wouldn’t be this much discussion. It happens that this year with the AD’s trying to do things different, there is a dumpster fire in Region A and D for two separate issues. I don’t think anyone is completely happy with the number of classifications, alignment, number of teams, attendance cut offs, power points, etc. Funny thing is, after football is over, it gets much quieter in regards to all of those things. We all know football is the golden goose for most schools with student populations under 1200. There are about 1201 ideas on how to fix the system but every one of them are flawed as well.
In about 10 hours or less we will all see the post from a poster touting their plan to fix everything with a hard cap on 1A then divide the others amongst 3 classifications. Still gonna have teams that can cherry pick points if that’s what at you want to call it. The only way you eliminate that is if there is no more playing outside your classification regardless if it was a historical rivalry or not.
Ok soapbox is wobbling again, keep it going.

 

[Gunz41]

It’s not clear cut in SWVA either or there wouldn’t be this much discussion. It happens that this year with the AD’s trying to do things different, there is a dumpster fire in Region A and D for two separate issues. I don’t think anyone is completely happy with the number of classifications, alignment, number of teams, attendance cut offs, power points, etc. Funny thing is, after football is over, it gets much quieter in regards to all of those things. We all know football is the golden goose for most schools with student populations under 1200. There are about 1201 ideas on how to fix the system but every one of them are flawed as well.
In about 10 hours or less we will all see the post from a poster touting their plan to fix everything with a hard cap on 1A then divide the others amongst 3 classifications. Still gonna have teams that can cherry pick points if that’s what at you want to call it. The only way you eliminate that is if there is no more playing outside your classification regardless if it was a historical rivalry or not.
Ok soapbox is wobbling again, keep it going.

Maybe my point wasn't clear, it's black and white in SWVA as you have all these 1A and 2A schools together in a short distance.

 

[GrahamHighGmen]

Maybe meet somewhere in the middle with points played for opponents. For example, under the current system, you get the extra two points for level drop to account for the difference. So basically, a 3A school playing a 2A school gets the points they would have gotten for playing another 3A school. Split that difference, cut it in half. This way, there is at least some kind of reward or basically, there isn't a big penalty for playing down where scheduling can be difficult for some teams. But at the same time, maybe splitting that difference can possibly help to deter those from completely gaming the system. <---------------And by the way, the above isn't difficult to do. If Region A can create an entire new ranking system in one month's time frame, then the above could be done.

Just a thought or opinion I gave. Will this ever happen? Odds are 99 out of 100 it won't, but it's fun to discuss.

 

[Union_Fan]

Therein lies the problem. 1A games should not get the same as 2A games. You’re rewarding schools who choose to play a weaker schedule. I.E. Lee High playing East Mont & Rye Cove while Gate City played Radford & Richlands. Gate City beat Lee & finished above them in the district yet Lee got in while Gate City did not. We have a flawed system on some levels.

I would tend to agree about not getting credit for playing down, but it's also a double-edged sword. If you don't get credit for playing down, how do you get the opportunity to play up?

If a 2A team doesn't get credit for playing a 1A team, how can a 1A team improve their schedule? How would a 2A team be able to play a 3A or 4A? There would be no motivation on the 3/4A team to play down if they lost points.

Most 2A teams are facing a high probability of a loss by playing Riverheads. What if they also got points deducted for playing down? The Gladiators would probably be lucky to fill half their schedule each year.

GC is definitely better than Lee, and deserved that 8th spot, BUT they could have simply won another game, finished 5-5 and it wouldn't be a discussion. It is what it is I guess.

 

[Union_Fan]

They will be. There was an election.

I hope it is, and I don't care who gets the credit for it. Heck, you can have it! haha

 

[GrahamHighGmen]

I would tend to agree about not getting credit for playing down, but it's also a double-edged sword. If you don't get credit for playing down, how do you get the opportunity to play up?

If a 2A team doesn't get credit for playing a 1A team, how can a 1A team improve their schedule? How would a 2A team be able to play a 3A or 4A? There would be no motivation on the 3/4A team to play down if they lost points.

Most 2A teams are facing a high probability of a loss by playing Riverheads. What if they also got points deducted for playing down? The Gladiators would probably be lucky to fill half their schedule each year.

GC is definitely better than Lee, and deserved that 8th spot, BUT they could have simply won another game, finished 5-5 and it wouldn't be a discussion. It is what it is I guess.

Agree. Like I wrote, split the difference from 2 to 1. A Class 2 team gets the extra 2 points for playing the Class 1 school, so it's the "same"as playing another Class 2 school. Cut that in the half to 1 point instead of 2. This can still provide some help for a Class 2 school that plays down, and it still serves as a reward for the Class 1 school that is playing up, but it can also deter the Class 2 school's from completely gaming the system and playing down.

Another example, a Class 4 schools plays a Class 1 school. This means, that Class 4 school gets 6 points extra, which means it's the same as playing another Class 4 school. Cut that in half from 6 to 3.

 

[GrahamHighGmen]

Agree. Like I wrote, split the difference from 2 to 1. A Class 2 team gets the extra 2 points for playing the Class 1 school, so it's the "same"as playing another Class 2 school. Cut that in the half to 1 point instead of 2. This can still provide some help for a Class 2 school that plays down, and it still serves as a reward for the Class 1 school that is playing up, but it can also deter the Class 2 school's from completely gaming the system and playing down.

Another example, a Class 4 schools plays a Class 1 school. This means, that Class 4 school gets 6 points extra, which means it's the same as playing another Class 4 school. Cut that in half from 6 to 3.

I've read a bunch of stuff on here in past about how to improve vhsl rating system. Some is ok, some it not so ok. The idea you have is actually a very good one and makes sense.

 

[monarch82]

Could someone explain exactly how Region D decided who got in, and I apologize if i missed this above or in another thread. It seems SW used district records Richlands #2 and VA #3 even though VA had higher point total. In the M7 GC had better district record than Lee and beat Lee but Lee gets in and did have higher point total. Did each district decide? As someone else posted GC wins one more game and its moot, I was just wondering.

 

[Union_Fan]

Agree. Like I wrote, split the difference from 2 to 1. A Class 2 team gets the extra 2 points for playing the Class 1 school, so it's the "same"as playing another Class 2 school. Cut that in the half to 1 point instead of 2. This can still provide some help for a Class 2 school that plays down, and it still serves as a reward for the Class 1 school that is playing up, but it can also deter the Class 2 school's from completely gaming the system and playing down.

Another example, a Class 4 schools plays a Class 1 school. This means, that Class 4 school gets 6 points extra, which means it's the same as playing another Class 4 school. Cut that in half from 6 to 3.

I think I may work on a rating system that revises the values of a Class, but also emphasizes victories over not only your opponent, but also your opponent's opponents. And add value to the Class of the opponent's victories as well.

If we are truly trying to gauge how good a team is, it's hard to emphasize value on Class alone. For instance, a victory over 4A Blacksburg wouldn't have been worth nearly as much as a victory over 1A Riverheads in terms of victory quality.

 

[Union_Fan]

Could someone explain exactly how Region D decided who got in, and I apologize if i missed this above or in another thread. It seems SW used district records Richlands #2 and VA #3 even though VA had higher point total. In the M7 GC had better district record than Lee and beat Lee but Lee gets in and did have higher point total. Did each district decide? As someone else posted GC wins one more game and its moot, I was just wondering.

There are only 2 districts in 2D, so I guess that makes it a little easier to decide, especially, since most years, they are pretty evenly matched.

The SWD went by district record alone, regardless of powerpoints. The M7 went by powerpoints alone, regardless of district record.

 

[monarch82]

Thank you, for some reason I always thought it was a Region decision

 

[GrahamHighGmen]

Thank you, for some reason I always thought it was a Region decision

The only requirement from the Region was.......4 teams from each district get in, to make up the total of 8. The districts then decided how they would pick their top 4. SWD Top 4=district record. M7 Top 4-done by VHSL power rating.

Where the Region comes into play at this point is........There is no 1 and 8 seed or 2 vs 7 etc. There is actually two number 1 seeds, two number 2 seeds, two number 3 seeds, and two number 4 seeds.

 

[GrahamHighGmen]

I think I may work on a rating system that revises the values of a Class, but also emphasizes victories over not only your opponent, but also your opponent's opponents. And add value to the Class of the opponent's victories as well.

If we are truly trying to gauge how good a team is, it's hard to emphasize value on Class alone. For instance, a victory over 4A Blacksburg wouldn't have been worth nearly as much as a victory over 1A Riverheads in terms of victory quality.

I agree with you. The thing is, you are dealing with bureaucrats. Many of them with good intentions, but some of them loving that status, power, and title held, and that status, power, and title means MORE than the good intentions (for some of them, not all). So, what I'm getting at is, if you want change with these folks, think in small increments. Broad brushes, even though they could be a better solution, could find themselves shot down quicker than small increments.

 

[Gunz41]

I think I may work on a rating system that revises the values of a Class, but also emphasizes victories over not only your opponent, but also your opponent's opponents. And add value to the Class of the opponent's victories as well.

If we are truly trying to gauge how good a team is, it's hard to emphasize value on Class alone. For instance, a victory over 4A Blacksburg wouldn't have been worth nearly as much as a victory over 1A Riverheads in terms of victory quality.

You need to use a different example then that if you want to point out the points difference. Riverheads with a loss to someone is then 9-1. That is 18 rider points. If we are using a 2a team as the example, that is 36 points. A victory over Blacksburg is 22.

I am not saying the system is perfect, but to deemphasize larger schools playing smaller is just going to create a majority of in class games only, and some will not be able to fill a schedule.

These also could eliminate a bunch of out long standing rivalry/district games.

Heck, some teams have trouble finding opponents now. Riverheads had to go to Tazewell, Lord Botetourt, and Stuarts Draft for out of district games. Yes, they HAD to play twice.

If I were a betting man, I would venture to bet that there would not have been: King William vs Lafayette, Oscar Smith vs Phoebus, etc.

 

[GrahamHighGmen]

You need to use a different example then that if you want to point out the points difference. Riverheads with a loss to someone is then 9-1. That is 18 rider points. If we are using a 2a team as the example, that is 36 points. A victory over Blacksburg is 22.

I am not saying the system is perfect, but to deemphasize larger schools playing smaller is just going to create a majority of in class games only, and some will not be able to fill a schedule.

These also could eliminate a bunch of out long standing rivalry/district games.

Heck, some teams have trouble finding opponents now. Riverheads had to go to Tazewell, Lord Botetourt, and Stuarts Draft for out of district games. Yes, they HAD to play twice.

If I were a betting man, I would venture to bet that there would not have been: King William vs Lafayette, Oscar Smith vs Phoebus, etc.

Agree, but you can have the best of both worlds. Split the difference in Classification Points. It will not discourage larger schools from playing smaller ones because it's not a complete loss of points, but it will help some schools from gaming the system. For example, a Blacksburg Class 4 vs Giles, Class 1. BBurg would get those 6 points in the current system. Give em 3 instead, and I feel confident, them getting only 3 instead of 6 would NOT be enough of a discouragement for them to not schedule that game. As for Class 2 teams taking it easy and playing all Class 1 teams outside of its district like Lee High did, I equally feel confident that them not getting the full 2 points, but only getting 1 point would cause enough of a concern that would at least pick it 1 or 2 more Class 2 schools.

There is no question that they should not penalize bigger schools for playing small ones, but........they've gone to far with the full 2 point per level make up difference. It's to much. It didn't have to be "all or none". They went "all" with the current system. It could have been somewhere in the middle. Again though, the above is just my take out of several other opinions. Don't mean it's right or wrong.

 

[BigWinners]

Agree, but you can have the best of both worlds. Split the difference in Classification Points. It will not discourage larger schools from playing smaller ones because it's not a complete loss of points, but it will help some schools from gaming the system. For example, a Blacksburg Class 4 vs Giles, Class 1. BBurg would get those 6 points in the current system. Give em 3 instead, and I feel confident, them getting only 3 instead of 6 would NOT be enough of a discouragement for them to not schedule that game. As for Class 2 teams taking it easy and playing all Class 1 teams outside of its district like Lee High did, I equally feel confident that them not getting the full 2 points, but only getting 1 point would cause enough of a concern that would at least pick it 1 or 2 more Class 2 schools.

There is no question that they should not penalize bigger schools for playing small ones, but........they've gone to far with the full 2 point per level make up difference. It's to much. It didn't have to be "all or none". They went "all" with the current system. It could have been somewhere in the middle. Again though, the above is just my take out of several other opinions. Don't mean it's right or wrong.

Lee High hadn't won a game, ONE GAME, in two plus years. Dunno how anyone can fault them for scheduling a more competitive OOC schedule. They didn't intentionally do it to sneak in to playoffs, they were simply trying to get a W.

 

[Gunz41]

Agree, but you can have the best of both worlds. Split the difference in Classification Points. It will not discourage larger schools from playing smaller ones because it's not a complete loss of points, but it will help some schools from gaming the system. For example, a Blacksburg Class 4 vs Giles, Class 1. BBurg would get those 6 points in the current system. Give em 3 instead, and I feel confident, them getting only 3 instead of 6 would NOT be enough of a discouragement for them to not schedule that game. As for Class 2 teams taking it easy and playing all Class 1 teams outside of its district like Lee High did, I equally feel confident that them not getting the full 2 points, but only getting 1 point would cause enough of a concern that would at least pick it 1 or 2 more Class 2 schools.

There is no question that they should not penalize bigger schools for playing small ones, but........they've gone to far with the full 2 point per level make up difference. It's to much. It didn't have to be "all or none". They went "all" with the current system. It could have been somewhere in the middle. Again though, the above is just my take out of several other opinions. Don't mean it's right or wrong.

Even making it splitting the difference is penalizing them.

Look at it this way, in 2B, the difference between 1-3 is 8 points I believe (7 between CW and SD, CC played more games so a bit harder to tell). SD has to play 2 1a teams, and had to play one of them twice. That is 3 points.

By doing something like that unilaterally without weighing things in, you can punish teams because of where they are located. That was my point before, 2D has the luxury of having that many teams in the vicinity. Stuarts Draft now has 1 team in 2a within an hour or so. Riverheads has 2 within an hour in 1a. And poor Harrisonburg, they are 5a now, exactly what are they supposed to do? And this isn't relegated to just this area, but different scenarios all over the state.

Just step back from the Region D lens (not saying that is a bad thing), and think about the differences in school proximity across the state.

Or heck, just look at Union and Central. They tied overall. So you really think one of them should get LESS points for playing Galax?

 

[Union_Fan]

You need to use a different example then that if you want to point out the points difference. Riverheads with a loss to someone is then 9-1. That is 18 rider points. If we are using a 2a team as the example, that is 36 points. A victory over Blacksburg is 22.

I am not saying the system is perfect, but to deemphasize larger schools playing smaller is just going to create a majority of in class games only, and some will not be able to fill a schedule.

These also could eliminate a bunch of out long standing rivalry/district games.

Heck, some teams have trouble finding opponents now. Riverheads had to go to Tazewell, Lord Botetourt, and Stuarts Draft for out of district games. Yes, they HAD to play twice.

If I were a betting man, I would venture to bet that there would not have been: King William vs Lafayette, Oscar Smith vs Phoebus, etc.

I wasn't actually referring to powerpoints at all, but what is considered a quality victory.

I'm talking about a rating system that takes in to account more than class and wins.

Just because a team is 9-0 or 6A doesn't make them good. I used the comparison of Blacksburg and Riverheads because Blacksburg was absolutely terrible this year. Beating them doesn't make one a good team. However, defeating Riverheads this year, would turn heads.

Take Reg D this year. Va High was blowing teams out of the water and scoring like crazy. They finished 8-2, but one of those losses was to a team that only won 3 other games. Once you know that, suddenly, their other victories lose their luster.

Their wins weren't of the best quality, but their powerpoint rating would say otherwise.

Powerpoints alone don't indicate how good a team is or how good their wins are. I would love to come up with a new system that does.

I have nothing against teams playing up or down. A quality win can be had playing down just the same as playing up.

 

[BigWinners]

I wasn't actually referring to powerpoints at all, but what is considered a quality victory.

I'm talking about a rating system that takes in to account more than class and wins.

Just because a team is 9-0 or 6A doesn't make them good. I used the comparison of Blacksburg and Riverheads because Blacksburg was absolutely terrible this year. Beating them doesn't make one a good team. However, defeating Riverheads this year, would turn heads.

Take Reg D this year. Va High was blowing teams out of the water and scoring like crazy. They finished 8-2, but one of those losses was to a team that only won 3 other games. Once you know that, suddenly, their other victories lose their luster.

Their wins weren't of the best quality, but their powerpoint rating would say otherwise.

Powerpoints alone don't indicate how good a team is or how good their wins are. I would love to come up with a new system that does.

I have nothing against teams playing up or down. A quality win can be had playing down just the same as playing up.

I like the idea in theory, but how do you keep it from turning out like the AP Poll, or worse the BCS? lol. When you start adding subjectivity to the process, things can get very wonky very quickly. If it was a system without bias that could accurately gauge each team, it's an absolutely perfect system and the VHSL would be foolish not to do it. But if a system allows ADs and coaches any say in it, you're guaranteeing bias and teams voting or polling in their own self interest. But if there's a way to do it, it would certainly be optimal. Beating 9-1 1A Twin Springs prob shouldn't be weighed the same as beating 7-3 Wise or 9-1 KW, but until we can figure out a better way, I think the current system makes sense.

 

[Union_Fan]

I like the idea in theory, but how do you keep it from turning out like the AP Poll, or worse the BCS? lol. When you start adding subjectivity to the process, things can get very wonky very quickly. If it was a system without bias that could accurately gauge each team, it's an absolutely perfect system and the VHSL would be foolish not to do it. But if a system allows ADs and coaches any say in it, you're guaranteeing bias and teams voting or polling in their own self interest. But if there's a way to do it, it would certainly be optimal. Beating 9-1 1A Twin Springs prob shouldn't be weighed the same as beating 7-3 Wise or 9-1 KW, but until we can figure out a better way, I think the current system makes sense.

Not talking about subjectivity either. It would be a ratings system, purely mathematical, using an algorithm.

May work on that over the off-season, but doubt I would share it with the VHSL. Haha

 

[RedPrideNation_RollPride]

It’s absolutely possible. CalPreps has their prediction model that is generally in the 70-80% range. It’s statistical analysis to the nth degree.

 

[Foosballer]

At the end of the day with the current system that is in place....IMO the best team is going to win the championship some losing teams may get dropped but the winners are getting in.

 

[BigWinners]

Not talking about subjectivity either. It would be a ratings system, purely mathematical, using an algorithm.

May work on that over the off-season, but doubt I would share it with the VHSL. Haha

I'm genuinely curious. Without subjectivity, you can solely rely on numbers. Under that scenario, teams would have an incentive to run up the score on lesser teams to score style points and increase their overall winning margin. I'm not saying it's a bad idea, in fact I'm saying the opposote: it's a great idea and if you can build a reliable enough formula, you can probably make a few dollars by putting it behind a paywall.

you'll still have to deal with issues like teams feasting on cupcakes to increase wins, but if you can figure out how to properly weigh each team it could be a fantastic tool.

 

[BigWinners]

It’s absolutely possible. CalPreps has their prediction model that is generally in the 70-80% range. It’s statistical analysis to the nth degree.

It's usually very reliable but that's just a game predictor, it's not been seriously used in any attempt to rank teams for any playoff have they? I thought we were talking about a system of ranking teams for playoff seeding, I could be confused