FINAL: Sherando 21 - Martinsburg (WV) 14

[hamspear]

That's true Rod, there is a huge amount of more football talent in some areas of this state. and I'm not saying LT IS UNDISCIPLINED , I am saying because the fact that have so much skill and talent it allows them to be undisciplined and take chances any time they want. If you have a huge amount of talent , the coaching is not as important to reach a certain level of play , because it is easier. You will never see it , mistakes that is, because of the tremendous speed. When you can stick two D-1 corners out on a island and say go cover, and you know nobody is going to be able to beat them, think about what you can do in the box with 5 or 6 more college bound players. and just how many schools have more than 3or 4'college bound football players in 4A. I would say not that many. LT probably has at least 15-20 players minimum college bound players on the team. Not saying LT does not have fine coaches, however I myself enjoy watching coaches become successful with far less talent. And as far as Sherando goes, they do need to get a lot better with the bad snaps and stuff, but the success of Sherando football in Frederick county Virginia has nothing to do with enrollment, it is because they have a established coaching staff in place for a while now. There is definitely not a overflowing amount of talent at Sherando high school. it's the program and the system combined with very good coaching.

 

[hamspear]

If the West indeed has less talent as you say, then wouldn't it also be true that the coaches who are "doing more with less" are also coaching against less talented teams?

Yes in most situations .Hard to teach speed, How many sub 4.5 speed guys you think LT has on the team 5?, maybe 10? There is maybe one on Sherando barely breaking 4.5 ( that's a stretch also) and maybe one player on every team In my area that has that kind of speed. last team in my area to have two sub 4.5 guys on the whole team was Handley with Washington and Mauck. How many players on highland springs have sub 4.5 speed? How about Dinwiddie? I am not trying to break down LT or anything, they are a exceptional team, I am just saying it's a heck of a lot easier to build a team , when you have a abundance of talent.

 

[DEVILSLB99]

That's true Rod, there is a huge amount of more football talent in some areas of this state. and I'm not saying LT IS UNDISCIPLINED , I am saying because the fact that have so much skill and talent it allows them to be undisciplined and take chances any time they want. If you have a huge amount of talent , the coaching is not as important to reach a certain level of play , because it is easier. You will never see it , mistakes that is, because of the tremendous speed. When you can stick two D-1 corners out on a island and say go cover, and you know nobody is going to be able to beat them, think about what you can do in the box with 5 or 6 more college bound players. and just how many schools have more than 3or 4'college bound football players in 4A. I would say not that many. LT probably has at least 15-20 players minimum college bound players on the team. Not saying LT does not have fine coaches, however I myself enjoy watching coaches become successful with far less talent. And as far as Sherando goes, they do need to get a lot better with the bad snaps and stuff, but the success of Sherando football in Frederick county Virginia has nothing to do with enrollment, it is because they have a established coaching staff in place for a while now. There is definitely not a overflowing amount of talent at Sherando high school. it's the program and the system combined with very good coaching.

Man I wish we had that many kids, but the reality is we don't. It's system, scheme, coaching, and confidence that win at LT. Our kids step on the field expecting to win because we have built that winning culture starting on JV. We don't have a ton of 4.4 guys on the roster, but we have quick guys that can go sideline to sideline all day.

 

[Snookasuperstar]

Man I wish we had that many kids, but the reality is we don't. It's system, scheme, coaching, and confidence that win at LT. Our kids step on the field expecting to win because we have built that winning culture starting on JV. We don't have a ton of 4.4 guys on the roster, but we have quick guys that can go sideline to sideline all day.

Yeah and you guys walk the walk pure and simple. I don't know how far you all go this year, but it will be a deep run. I thought your kids showed alot of class being up 38-0 while Monticello band/fan chanted overrated. You guys could have pointed to score board or even replied back to them, but instead your kids just put the L.T flag up and waived it around collectively as a TEAM. That is a culture that demonstrates self discipline, team first, and self morals. Many teams would have responded inappropriately to the crowd your team did not. That's impressive. I still do not know what Monticello band/fans were doing chanting that being down 38-0.

 

[hamspear]

devils, in no way at all do I not think that the coaching staff is a fine one. They probably rank right up there with the top coaching staffs I the whole state. I am just saying in general , the east side of the state has more talent pool to draw from than the west side. now , that's not saying that a West team cannot have a special year, and the stars line up for them, and put together a great season and win a big state game against a East final opponent, but I think we are a ways away from that happening. NOT because of coaching,because of the talent in the west. Just my opinion, everyone has one.

 

[shauntclair]

devils, in no way at all do I not think that the coaching staff is a fine one. They probably rank right up there with the top coaching staffs I the whole state. I am just saying in general , the east side of the state has more talent pool to draw from than the west side. now , that's not saying that a West team cannot have a special year, and the stars line up for them, and put together a great season and win a big state game against a East final opponent, but I think we are a ways away from that happening. NOT because of coaching,because of the talent in the west. Just my opinion, everyone has one.

Question Hammy. Did George play in the Pitt game yesterday? I didn't see any stats for him. Then again, I didn't see stats for any of the Pitt Fullbacks. Doesn't look like any of them got the ball yesterday. Are they just used as blocking backs in their system? Anyway, nice game on Friday. Looking good.

 

[hamspear]

yes he started at fullback , if you go to espn3 highlights and watch John Connors first 40 yard run , he is the lead blocker, it was a great block. George is 35. I don't think he got any carries at fullback, but he is a devastating lead blocker

 

[DEVILSLB99]

devils, in no way at all do I not think that the coaching staff is a fine one. They probably rank right up there with the top coaching staffs I the whole state. I am just saying in general , the east side of the state has more talent pool to draw from than the west side. now , that's not saying that a West team cannot have a special year, and the stars line up for them, and put together a great season and win a big state game against a East final opponent, but I think we are a ways away from that happening. NOT because of coaching,because of the talent in the west. Just my opinion, everyone has one.

I got ya. I think its because the populations are way different and the talent is concentrated in the 7 cities. If you look at the schools in the counties (Franklin, James City, etc) that surround the 7 cities they resemble the western part of the state. I'm pretty sure they don't have 7 cities right on top of each other in the Western part of the state. Where I live in Chesapeake I'm a 5 minute drive from Norfolk and a 5 minute drive from Portsmouth. I can get to Suffolk in 10 Virginia Beach in 10. Newport News and Hampton are 20-25 minutes away so the dynamic around here is very different. 37 of the 39 High Schools are quick trips with Hickory and Gloucester being the farthest.

 

[VaPrepsRod]

Yes in most situations .Hard to teach speed, How many sub 4.5 speed guys you think LT has on the team 5?, maybe 10? There is maybe one on Sherando barely breaking 4.5 ( that's a stretch also) and maybe one player on every team In my area that has that kind of speed. last team in my area to have two sub 4.5 guys on the whole team was Handley with Washington and Mauck. How many players on highland springs have sub 4.5 speed? How about Dinwiddie? I am not trying to break down LT or anything, they are a exceptional team, I am just saying it's a heck of a lot easier to build a team , when you have a abundance of talent.

How many 4.5 guys per week does LT have to try to stop?

You're comparing Sherando vs LT but you won't compare Sherando's opponents vs LT's opponents. You act like their opponents are the same.

Fact is that most schools in Lake Taylor's district have put more guys in the NFL than Lake Taylor has, so it's not like the Titans are wheeling out 5 D1 players against teams of homeless orphans.

 

[hamspear]

I don't think I am comparing any opponents, I am speaking straight up , The eastern side of the state has more football talent than the west. if you want to compare talent between Sherando and Lake Taylor no need to go further and look at va preps own recruiting page. Look at how many active recruits are from Lake Taylor compared to Sherando . I looked at from classes 2014-2017 of both schools. Score lake Taylor about 9-2. so if your saying Lake Taylor doesn't have as many college recruits as there competition around them , then it only validates my point more, the talent is even on the teams in the east that lake Taylor is beating and don't have the coaching. lake Taylor's fine coaching only makes them much better than there opponents. But in a east- west comparison, no doubt the talent is in the East. unless your saying Rod, that the coaching in the west is so bad, and the east coaching is so good, is that the difference?

 

[shauntclair]

yes he started at fullback , if you go to espn3 highlights and watch John Connors first 40 yard run , he is the lead blocker, it was a great block. George is 35. I don't think he got any carries at fullback, but he is a devastating lead blocker

No. No carries according to the stat sheet. I understand why he's in that role now. He's pretty fast for a guy his size and relishes contact. I doubt if he cares whether he carries the ball or not. As long as he's hitting somebody, he'll be happy. I'll continue to watch for his progress. GL next Friday. Fine start to the season. Some things to iron out but you got W's. Sign of good things. Well done Warriors.

 

[hamspear]

George is the perfect example of some who does not care about Td's , yards , glory. He lives for one thing - physically dominating players, crushing blocks and putting people on there ass! Haha.

 

[VaPrepsRod]

I don't think I am comparing any opponents, I am speaking straight up , The eastern side of the state has more football talent than the west. if you want to compare talent between Sherando and Lake Taylor no need to go further and look at va preps own recruiting page. Look at how many active recruits are from Lake Taylor compared to Sherando . I looked at from classes 2014-2017 of both schools. Score lake Taylor about 9-2. so if your saying Lake Taylor doesn't have as many college recruits as there competition around them , then it only validates my point more, the talent is even on the teams in the east that lake Taylor is beating and don't have the coaching. lake Taylor's fine coaching only makes them much better than there opponents. But in a east- west comparison, no doubt the talent is in the East. unless your saying Rod, that the coaching in the west is so bad, and the east coaching is so good, is that the difference?

No, YOU said that the coaching was better in the West because they have "lesser" athletes.

What I say, and know, is that there are good coaches in Tidewater, NoVa, Richmond and everywhere else in the state. There are bad coaches in Tidewater, NoVa, Richmond and everywhere else in the state.

There is no "better" or "worse" when it comes to coaching in specific areas. There is only good and bad, regardless of where it is located.

I don't understand how you guys end up thinking that there are different "brands" of football based on geographic location.

 

[hamspear]

I must have mis written my point, I agree with you , that there is good coaching and BAD coaching throughout the state. I am just saying the talent level is not the same across the state.think what I was saying is that sometimes it is more visible from my area to me , because I can see the coaching that makes a huge difference more because the talent is not always there as compared to the rest of the state. however, if a west team beats a East team and the West team has less talent , wouldn't it be the coaching that makes the difference?
And of course. You are going to say that the coaching is great everywhere, lol Hard to sell subscriptions when you alienate a program or ever say anything controversial about anyone. Keep it real Rod, we are all not idiots on here.

 

[VaPrepsRod]

I must have mis written my point, I agree with you , that there is good coaching and BAD coaching throughout the state. I am just saying the talent level is not the same across the state.think what I was saying is that sometimes it is more visible from my area to me , because I can see the coaching that makes a huge difference more because the talent is not always there as compared to the rest of the state. however, if a west team beats a East team and the West team has less talent , wouldn't it be the coaching that makes the difference?
And of course. You are going to say that the coaching is great everywhere, lol Hard to sell subscriptions when you alienate a program or ever say anything controversial about anyone. Keep it real Rod, we are all not idiots on here.

I didn't come close to saying that the "coaching is great everywhere". I said that there are some great coaches in every area AND I said that there are some bad coaches in every area.

If you think that I don't say things that are controversial then you have never been in a conversation with me. However, there is nothing controversial to the simple truth that coaching ability has nothing to do with one's zip code.

It's a beautiful argument that some of you guys have set up...

If we beat the East, we are smarter.
If they beat us, they just have better athletes and we are just victims of where we live.

If you can't see good coaching when there is good talent on the field, that's on you, not on the coaches.

 

[hamspear]

I see great coaches everywhere also, however I believe it's a lot easier to coach and win with great talent , then it is to coach and win with less talent. and yes the competition level is lower in the west because of less talent, not less coaching. How do you define " brand" of football? Is that a " type " of football? If that is the case, then yes I believe the East does play a different brand of football. Sorry if we disagree.

 

[anon_vu6vqwsr4nf3b]

Salem, one of the best teams in the West with one of the best coaching staffs, got out-athleted but mostly out-COACHED in Lynchburg last year, in my opinion. But what do I know? I'm just an uneducated fan.

 

[hamspear]

Do you think Salem got out coached in the state final. Interesting .

 

[VaPrepsRod]

I see great coaches everywhere also, however I believe it's a lot easier to coach and win with great talent , then it is to coach and win with less talent. and yes the competition level is lower in the west because of less talent, not less coaching. How do you define " brand" of football? Is that a " type " of football? If that is the case, then yes I believe the East does play a different brand of football. Sorry if we disagree.

Then we are back to my original point that you aren't giving the teams with talent (The East) credit for beating teams with talent.

The Tidewater teams have more individual talent than the teams in the West but, during the regular season, they do not enjoy any more of a talent gap over their opponents than the tops teams in the West do over theirs.

 

[hamspear]

ok , I see what you are saying, and I agree with your point completely , they definitely deserve the credit for beating teams in the East with the same caliber of talent during the regular season. so Rod , how many teams deep are the East before a West team can compete talent and coaching combined head to head? Does your 4A top ten reflect how you really feel or are you adjusting your top ten based on record and past success regardless of what you feel would happen head to head? Would a 1 seed in the west beat the 5 seed in the east right now?

 

[VaPrepsRod]

ok , I see what you are saying, and I agree with your point completely , they definitely deserve the credit for beating teams in the East with the same caliber of talent during the regular season. so Rod , how many teams deep are the East before a West team can compete talent and coaching combined head to head? Does your 4A top ten reflect how you really feel or are you adjusting your top ten based on record and past success regardless of what you feel would happen head to head? Would a 1 seed in the west beat the 5 seed in the east right now?

I do not believe that the purpose of a top ten ranking is to say how programs would perform in head-to-head competition. That is the purpose of predictions articles.

I would say the top seed in the West is probably about the equivalent of a #3 or #4 seed in the East, just off the top of my head. However, traditionally, the champion of the East (2013 Dinwiddie and 2014 Lake Taylor) is head and shoulders above everyone else, regardless of zip code.

And now that you have made two not-so-veiled references to a lack of integrity on my part when it comes to covering teams, I'll exit this conversation by saying that, when it comes to talking about me, you need to do a ton more research.

A TON.

 

[hamspear]

Lack of integrity ? By no means was I ever insinuating any lack of integrity. I was just asking your thoughts on how you thought the west stood up against the East at this point, and whether your 4A top ten reflected that or if you had a different formula? You get around the whole state unlike a lot of us , and see a lot of teams. sorry if I hurt your feelings , geesh it's totally not a integrity issue.

 

[shauntclair]

Do you think Salem got out coached in the state final. Interesting .

I find Hoos's observation interesting also. I felt the Coach's from each team were very, very good. LT was just way better. The best team won. Simple as that. IMO.

That doesn't mean I haven't seen teams out Coached before. I've also seen Coaching failures. Salem/LT definitely not on my list for either.

 

[hamspear]

I agree both those programs are well coached for sure. I mean seriously how can you in this day get to a state final without good coaching. LT was a superior team, as was Dinwiddie the year prior.