Halftime at Blacksburg

[EVcyc]

LP or LPD is fine with me. Doesn’t bother me either way. LPD is actually the acronym VT uses for “Lunch Paul Defense” which inspired the name.

I love messing with people too so I’m on board.



Not for the regional rounds. That’s handled by an association commissioner. State rounds (semis and finals) are assigned by the VHSL, and they require the crew to be out of area for both teams involved. That’s true for other sports besides football as well.



You can disagree about the timeout call if you’d like, but I was right there when the whistle was blown and when the coach was yelling for it. I have a first hand account. It was before the snap. The official running out to the middle of the field was delayed, but not the timeout call or the whistle.

Officials don’t throw flags when they deem there was no foul. That’s it.

Since you care about when it was called, the only penalty EV had called against them was an illegal block on an uneventful kickoff return in the middle of the 3rd quarter. Inconsequential to anything that happened in the game.

I don’t know nor do I care how often a home team fan leaves the game feeling like they had a call go against them. The simple explanation is it’s irrelevant. The idea of “home cooking” is something that fans tell themselves to justify their feelings and put blame on someone else. That’s fine, but as I said before, it’s a flat out lie. Missed calls? Sure, they happen, and you can be mad about that understandably so. Collusion by the officials? You’re playing yourself. It doesn’t happen. When you’re on the field or on the court as an official, you’re too focused on the action to even realize which jersey color relates to what team. You know offense and defense and which color is which, but there’s no time to decipher anything else and still focus on the play. Everything is happening way too fast to recognize which team from place XYZ is doing what.

As a side note, here’s something that you, and other away fans saying the officials are colluding, don’t know or haven’t thought about. I’m not just talking about this game, but any game in general. The home team falls under that officiating association’s coverage for the regional round. If that home team in the association’s coverage area makes it to states, that’s one less game that that association is eligible to officiate at the state semis and finals level. Why would an official intentionally reduce their chances of being able to officiate a state game?

That fact in and of itself should tell fans how ludicrous the idea of refs “cheating” is. Not only is it against their own morals, it’s not even in their own best interest.

LP, I have read several of your post, and you seem like an intelligent person, even reasonable for this board (of course I have limited data and you could be just average intelligence, I'm sure you will let me know), but you appear to be choosing what words of mine you will respond to and which ones you will ignore. First, thanks for allowing me to disagree.
Second NEVER did I say cheat or collude. I'm going to have to guess by your passion on this topic that you have been here before. You appear to be making every comment about officials and rules very personal. Sorry for what ever happened to you.

My whole side is the atmosphere of the moment, the home crowd.. no premeditated thought to it, no I'm going to screw this team. I look at the idea that it very rarely happens at home as there has to be some influence, it's just too often to be nothing (stats would probably say this is a real thing). Homecooking is what everyone calls it.. it's probably not the right term.
Now I'm not willing to lump all officials everywhere like you seem to be, but if was a betting man not everyone is as morally wholesome as you suggest.
Also, and I can't say this any different than I have now twice.. There were very few penalties called, I liked it. I didn't think any called penalties impacted the game. Were there no calls, yes. Were they part of this game yes.
I understand what some people use this board for, and I guess what I use it for just isn't the same. I noticed the other day, after I jokingly said Dinwiddie has 2 Popes and referred to divine intervention, BleedingNavy took that to twitter to say EV said Dinwiddie needed Divine intervention when you read everything with a negative eye or angst, I guess that's what it becomes.

 

[DanvilleSportsHead]

Wow. That took me a minute to catch up.. First, I by no means was saying the game was impacted or the outcome was due to the refs. I even said EV had plenty opportunities to win that game. I wrote the game was a well officiated game.. Did you guys read my full post? I 100% apologize if that was taken any way other than adding to the commenting about HS officials.

That being said, I will still disagree with the timeout call. Unless there is another angle of the coaches and another official, I don't see any evidence of anyone calling a timeout. You actually see the WRs on his side look back at coaches then turn back to the line. No one on the field or the ref were acting anyway but performing the next play. I only can comment on what I saw and see. If I am wrong that is ok. Same holds true for the pulling call. The player is grabbing the runner not any pile. For that never being called comment, I have seen it called plenty.

Penalties in this game were like I said, the refs simply didn't throw flags, which again I said in my post I really liked that. And there were penalties on both sides not called.

Not all penalties are created equal either, when a penalty is called (or not called) is just as impact full. So I never care about how many are called, I like to note when they are called.

As far as homer stuff goes. My point there is how often (I've personally never seen it or even heard about it) does the home team leave a game from their home field complaining about a call that cost them the game. I'm sure it happens, but the atmosphere at any place just lends to that home cooking feel. I think it's hard not to be influenced by it. Now I recognize I am now talking to a couple officials and there is emotion in this conversation, so I will just bow out of that.

DSH.. No one pissed in my flakes. Did you not like being teased about being just a bit off on everything you talked about for weeks. Weren't you the guy who wrote truth hurts (when we were talking about something that had not happened yet.. ). I'm just sad that I won't have to read your hyped up words of fantasy anymore.

I will say, just like I felt when we lost that epic game to JF a few years ago. I was very happy for EV. I did not feel the least bit bitter or angry or hostile. They (both teams) played an amazing game. EV took that next step, yeah you want more but I was very happy with it. Guys I am not an emotional person, not one way or the other. I spend 50% of my day in the realm of humor. I don't hate, and I don't really get worked up. I have been married 24 years and not once have we had an argument, not once. So believe me when I say, I simply like information, I enjoy breaking down moments and solving problems. When I watch a play for example I watch it over and over watching each player and what they do.

I understand when you read something about the game that appears to take away from the victory or tarnish it, how that would upset people, so for that I do apologize. Certainly the best football game I have seen at the HS level. Both teams actually impressed me with how they were able to be so intense (btw the war going on on both lines was brutal, these kids were warriors) and yet stay composed where the game wasn't riddled with unsportsmanlike like conduct penalties.

So now I don't usually hang on to the boards once EV footballs season is over, so if I miss any other follow up comments or emotional reactions, I apologize for that stuff too.

Take your L and move on. You make EV look bad.

 

[LunchPailD]

LP, I have read several of your post, and you seem like an intelligent person, even reasonable for this board (of course I have limited data and you could be just average intelligence, I'm sure you will let me know), but you appear to be choosing what words of mine you will respond to and which ones you will ignore. First, thanks for allowing me to disagree.
Second NEVER did I say cheat or collude. I'm going to have to guess by your passion on this topic that you have been here before. You appear to be making every comment about officials and rules very personal. Sorry for what ever happened to you.

My whole side is the atmosphere of the moment, the home crowd.. no premeditated thought to it, no I'm going to screw this team. I look at the idea that it very rarely happens at home as there has to be some influence, it's just too often to be nothing (stats would probably say this is a real thing). Homecooking is what everyone calls it.. it's probably not the right term.
Now I'm not willing to lump all officials everywhere like you seem to be, but if was a betting man not everyone is as morally wholesome as you suggest.
Also, and I can't say this any different than I have now twice.. There were very few penalties called, I liked it. I didn't think any called penalties impacted the game. Were there no calls, yes. Were they part of this game yes.
I understand what some people use this board for, and I guess what I use it for just isn't the same. I noticed the other day, after I jokingly said Dinwiddie has 2 Popes and referred to divine intervention, BleedingNavy took that to twitter to say EV said Dinwiddie needed Divine intervention when you read everything with a negative eye or angst, I guess that's what it becomes.

Like you've said previously, I don't take anything personal especially on a message board. Nothing's happened to me, although I have had this discussion before. It doesn't irritate me if that's what you are insinuating when you say I've "been here before." I'm just stating the facts as they are presented. With me, it's not about what's personal. It's just about making sure incorrect information isn't spread like a virus. If spreading correct information about officials and rules is "taking it personal," then I'm sorry that I'm taking it personal.

A loud environment is great to witness, but it has absolutely no bearing on any calls. The fact is fans are 30-40 yards away and it's very easy to drown out. Sorry that you feel that I was picking and choosing. I don't believe I missed any point that you made in your post.

The officials I'm "lumping" are the ones in the Richmond area and in the Roanoke area, the two groups being discussed in this thread. I can also speak for the ones in northern Virginia that I know. There are zero morally corrupted officials in any of those associations when it comes to the integrity of officiating and the game itself. I'm not saying everyone is a wholesome person off the field, because not everyone is, but on the field that's not the case. You can suggest that there may be some without any actual knowledge, but my actual knowledge is telling you the complete opposite. Think what you want, but you have a first hand account telling you the truth. Now, am I saying every official across the entire US is the same way? Of course not. I have no idea. If that's what you thought I was saying, it's not. There probably are at least a handful of morally corrupt officials somewhere in the US. But, that's not the case here in the Richmond, northern VA, or the Roanoke/NRV areas.

As a side note, I generally enjoy your posts. If my responses are coming off as "emotional," I promise you they're not. I'm just very direct, no sugar coating. I'm also glad that you were generally complimentary of the officials on this game because I thought they did a good job as well. Your boys played a heck of a game, and as DP said if there was more time on the clock it very easily could have gone the other way.

 

[DinwiddieProud]

Hey guys, this has actually been a really good thread. A discussion, offering facts, and having a passionate disagreement is exactly the type of topic we need more of. Great job gals and guys.

 

[Gunz41]

Wow. That took me a minute to catch up.. First, I by no means was saying the game was impacted or the outcome was due to the refs. I even said EV had plenty opportunities to win that game. I wrote the game was a well officiated game.. Did you guys read my full post? I 100% apologize if that was taken any way other than adding to the commenting about HS officials.

That being said, I will still disagree with the timeout call. Unless there is another angle of the coaches and another official, I don't see any evidence of anyone calling a timeout. You actually see the WRs on his side look back at coaches then turn back to the line. No one on the field or the ref were acting anyway but performing the next play. I only can comment on what I saw and see. If I am wrong that is ok. Same holds true for the pulling call. The player is grabbing the runner not any pile. For that never being called comment, I have seen it called plenty.

Penalties in this game were like I said, the refs simply didn't throw flags, which again I said in my post I really liked that. And there were penalties on both sides not called.

Not all penalties are created equal either, when a penalty is called (or not called) is just as impact full. So I never care about how many are called, I like to note when they are called.

As far as homer stuff goes. My point there is how often (I've personally never seen it or even heard about it) does the home team leave a game from their home field complaining about a call that cost them the game. I'm sure it happens, but the atmosphere at any place just lends to that home cooking feel. I think it's hard not to be influenced by it. Now I recognize I am now talking to a couple officials and there is emotion in this conversation, so I will just bow out of that.

DSH.. No one pissed in my flakes. Did you not like being teased about being just a bit off on everything you talked about for weeks. Weren't you the guy who wrote truth hurts (when we were talking about something that had not happened yet.. ). I'm just sad that I won't have to read your hyped up words of fantasy anymore.

I will say, just like I felt when we lost that epic game to JF a few years ago. I was very happy for EV. I did not feel the least bit bitter or angry or hostile. They (both teams) played an amazing game. EV took that next step, yeah you want more but I was very happy with it. Guys I am not an emotional person, not one way or the other. I spend 50% of my day in the realm of humor. I don't hate, and I don't really get worked up. I have been married 24 years and not once have we had an argument, not once. So believe me when I say, I simply like information, I enjoy breaking down moments and solving problems. When I watch a play for example I watch it over and over watching each player and what they do.

I understand when you read something about the game that appears to take away from the victory or tarnish it, how that would upset people, so for that I do apologize. Certainly the best football game I have seen at the HS level. Both teams actually impressed me with how they were able to be so intense (btw the war going on on both lines was brutal, these kids were warriors) and yet stay composed where the game wasn't riddled with unsportsmanlike like conduct penalties.

So now I don't usually hang on to the boards once EV footballs season is over, so if I miss any other follow up comments or emotional reactions, I apologize for that stuff too.

If the officials thought it was illegal what they saw, they would have called it.

As for the home cooking thing and never seeing it. I witnessed it this year, just to name one instance.

I am different than almost all fans that I have even been around. It's always the other team getting away with something or flag should never been thrown on their team. I know the rules pretty darn well, and not the type of fan that won't tell the truth. I also have about the best seat in the house for my teams home games being in press box.

Anyway here was the situation. Playing one of our biggest rivals. Their only loss last season was in final regular season game in a TIGHT game. They went on to beat everyone else by about 40 or more even the championship game. With the new schedule, they were playing game 4. Both undefeated again. Low scoring, back and forth game. Our team stops them with less than a minute to go to get ball back. After a decent gain, if I remember correctly, there were 2 more plays. First was a pass in the endzone that went right through the receivers hands. It could have been tipped there. Anyway, the last play of the game, throw to the sideline that had some contact. The HOME fans all go home feeling they got robbed and should have had another play. I didn't see a penalty.

There is also all the time from either the press box or at away games when you hear fans that have NO CLUE about the rules. And some will even ask me what the rule is. So sorry, but I think I will trust the answer from a few officials over a fan from a school who just lost. You kind of made me not trust your judgement on calls when you said your 3rd and 30

 

[hamspear]

Here is the “catch”

View embedded media

That’s a terrible call if they called that a catch

 

[DinwiddieProud]

If the officials thought it was illegal what they saw, they would have called it.

As for the home cooking thing and never seeing it. I witnessed it this year, just to name one instance.

I am different than almost all fans that I have even been around. It's always the other team getting away with something or flag should never been thrown on their team. I know the rules pretty darn well, and not the type of fan that won't tell the truth. I also have about the best seat in the house for my teams home games being in press box.

Anyway here was the situation. Playing one of our biggest rivals. Their only loss last season was in final regular season game in a TIGHT game. They went on to beat everyone else by about 40 or more even the championship game. With the new schedule, they were playing game 4. Both undefeated again. Low scoring, back and forth game. Our team stops them with less than a minute to go to get ball back. After a decent gain, if I remember correctly, there were 2 more plays. First was a pass in the endzone that went right through the receivers hands. It could have been tipped there. Anyway, the last play of the game, throw to the sideline that had some contact. The HOME fans all go home feeling they got robbed and should have had another play. I didn't see a penalty.

There is also all the time from either the press box or at away games when you hear fans that have NO CLUE about the rules. And some will even ask me what the rule is. So sorry, but I think I will trust the answer from a few officials over a fan from a school who just lost. You kind of made me not trust your judgement on calls when you said your 3rd and 30

Gunz, I'm fortunate to be in our press booth as well. It is amazing how much instant clarity the others can bring to a particular situation. No less than six sets of eyes on every play. Usually about 10 sets. And that is not counting the media or coaches. Or ECO is a semi-retired official. Two of our spotters have been in the booth forever. Our PA man is a veteran of many years behind the mic, and closely watching every play.

With this many sets of eyes, and a veteran official, not much doesn't get critiqued. For istance, "I didn't see the hold", and someone will say "yeah, 54 had a hand full of jersey when 77 beat him on the outside". Or on unusual flags, it will quickly be explained to us by the ECO what and why.

I wish there was a way this type of info could be communicated to the fans, but it's just not practical. Next season, we are considering offering to "mic up" any White Hat that is willing. I think this would be a big addition to the game experience for the fans. And it would make it easier for the officials to correct any errors on the clock.

Last week, there was a correction required that took more time than necessary. The White Hat had to walk over to our head coach, ask him to call his coaches in the press both to add time to the clock, wait for them to communicate this down stairs to the EOC, and then wait for the EOC to make the correction. The whole time this was going on, the fans on the EV side were hollering "fix the clock, fix the clock", and the fans on our side were screaming "why the delay, what's going on?" Having a mic on the officials would have really helped.

 

[Gunz41]

Gunz, I'm fortunate to be in our press booth as well. It is amazing how much instant clarity the others can bring to a particular situation. No less than six sets of eyes on every play. Usually about 10 sets. And that is not counting the media or coaches. Or ECO is a semi-retired official. Two of our spotters have been in the booth forever. Our PA man is a veteran of many years behind the mic, and closely watching every play.

With this many sets of eyes, and a veteran official, not much doesn't get critiqued. For istance, "I didn't see the hold", and someone will say "yeah, 54 had a hand full of jersey when 77 beat him on the outside". Or on unusual flags, it will quickly be explained to us by the ECO what and why.

I wish there was a way this type of info could be communicated to the fans, but it's just not practical. Next season, we are considering offering to "mic up" any White Hat that is willing. I think this would be a big addition to the game experience for the fans. And it would make it easier for the officials to correct any errors on the clock.

Last week, there was a correction required that took more time than necessary. The White Hat had to walk over to our head coach, ask him to call his coaches in the press both to add time to the clock, wait for them to communicate this down stairs to the EOC, and then wait for the EOC to make the correction. The whole time this was going on, the fans on the EV side were hollering "fix the clock, fix the clock", and the fans on our side were screaming "why the delay, what's going on?" Having a mic on the officials would have really helped.

That certainly would be an advantage.

You remember the story I told you earlier this year. It's funny to me hearing all these people everywhere who think they know everything, then open their mouth and show they don't know anything lol

Have another really funny story. With being involved so long I know pretty much everyone at a Stuarts Draft game, and I'm certainly not hard to identify. Anyway, when at an away game, get there early to have top row to stand. Especially our last game, where Robert E Lee has REALLY low away bleachers. Maybe 15-20 feet high. Anyway, this older man I have never seen was in front of us, someone I have never seen before. I'm about the nicest person someone will meet, but man was this guy bad. Not the sharpest crayon in the shed if you know what I mean. There were quite a few times he yelled out about a flag or "should be" flag. In EVERY case he was wrong.

Now I certainly don't know everything, and I can be wrong (told you with playoff format it has happened ONCE : ). I even understand the fans who think every call should be for their team, even being wrong. But what gets me is when people aren't there much, want to yell out, and don't know a rule. I mean how many high school football games do you have to attend to know something isn't a spot foul???

And being in press box I guess you have dealt with the "genius" radio announcers too huh

 

[DinwiddieProud]

Actually, the few live game coverage we have had covered from the press box have been done by true professionals. Andy Hayes and his crews from Gameday are second to no one doing live sports anywhere. I caught my self standing there watching THEM instead of the game. Last week the crew from the Culpeper Public Access channel, (sorry, I forget their proper name), was covering the EV game. Great bunch of folks. True professionals in every sense of the word. Now their broadcast was decidedly pro EV, but it should have been. It's their localities TV station. But they were great to work with.

So truthfully, "experts" that aren't experts are rare indeed in our press booth.

Now my funny story about officials. In 2013, I was asked to be the host and liaison for the game officials when we hosted the state semi-championship game. I was ready and prepared to crack the following joke on the White Hat when he showed up, but then...! He came in the door, all 6' 200" of him. I was instantly humbled and simply welcomed him.

What I was going to tell him was if he had any questions on interpretation and allication of the rules he could call on me, and he he thinks he didn't see something clearly to just ask me. I was sure I could see everything much clearer from 300' away than any of them could possibly see down on the field.

I wished I hadn't chickened out afterwards. What a terrific guy with a great sense of humor. The whole crew was like that. Funny, appreciative, and more concerned about my comfort than any needs they had. (It was cold as the dickens that day). On of my most enjoyable experiences in being around high school football.

 

[Gunz41]

Actually, the few live game coverage we have had covered from the press box have been done by true professionals. Andy Hayes and his crews from Gameday are second to no one doing live sports anywhere. I caught my self standing there watching THEM instead of the game. Last week the crew from the Culpeper Public Access channel, (sorry, I forget their proper name), was covering the EV game. Great bunch of folks. True professionals in every sense of the word. Now their broadcast was decidedly pro EV, but it should have been. It's their localities TV station. But they were great to work with.

So truthfully, "experts" that aren't experts are rare indeed in our press booth.

Now my funny story about officials. In 2013, I was asked to be the host and liaison for the game officials when we hosted the state semi-championship game. I was ready and prepared to crack the following joke on the White Hat when he showed up, but then...! He came in the door, all 6' 200" of him. I was instantly humbled and simply welcomed him.

What I was going to tell him was if he had any questions on interpretation and allication of the rules he could call on me, and he he thinks he didn't see something clearly to just ask me. I was sure I could see everything much clearer from 300' away than any of them could possibly see down on the field.

I wished I hadn't chickened out afterwards. What a terrific guy with a great sense of humor. The whole crew was like that. Funny, appreciative, and more concerned about my comfort than any needs they had. (It was cold as the dickens that day). On of my most enjoyable experiences in being around high school football.

The radio guys are certainly nice, but some are LOUD and can be annoying.

We tell the officials when they come up that we need their phone numbers and address to announce with their names. They always get a kick out of it

 

[DinwiddieProud]

We joke about giving that out every week!

 

[Gunz41]

We joke about giving that out every week!

I am very surprised the names themselves are given out. I've gotten to know a lot of them, but I can see that being a problem with some

 

[VolNation85]

That’s a terrible call if they called that a catch

They indeed did call that a catch. It was a very crucial moment in the game too. On this play, The score was 7-6 late in the 3rd quarter and 3rd and 8. Instead of it being 4th and 8 and Bburg punting, it was 1st and 10 plus an added 15 yards unsportsmanlike penalty for a Glass player protesting the horrible call. So it was a 40 yard gain on an incomplete pass. Bburg scored a few plays later from inside the Glass 10 yard line.

 

[AdvocateOfMany434]

Here is the “catch”

View embedded media

This is just plain out HORRIBLE REFFING.